Originally posted by Gerald Davis:
I don’t want to hear this man! I need the hardest certification to prove I know my stuff. I’m only on the first year of my degree. I want to know what the hardest certificate out there is .
Originally posted by Rufus Bugleweed:
I thought Shapiro showed more insight than you. Yet he scored lower than you.
Six hours, I would bet you spent more time than that arguing with Shapiro.
IMHO, Sun can't give any feed back or it will show up here and on yahoo. People are already giving away too many answers to the part one exam.
Originally posted by Rufus Bugleweed:
I told somebody around here I thought presentation was as important as content.
Which UML tool did you use?
Byron Estes<br />Sun Certified Enterprise Architect<br />Senior Consulant<br />Blackwell Consulting Services<br />Chicago, IL<br /><a href="http://www.bcsinc.com" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">www.bcsinc.com</a>
Which does bring up an important point, on which we do agree: Passing this exam does NOT make you an architect. I think the process of studying for it can help you work toward that goal, but experience and a mentor help too.
I think they should rotate assignments, and I think they could beef up the required/mandatory documents. Keep in mind, you can send them whatever else you want to help them understand/appreciate your design more clearly.
But who guarantees that they actually do such an effort and don't assess you using a random number generator? There's no feedback and that's the main problem.
Experience does beat a certification, but having a third party affirmation/assessment is good in that it provides another opinion of your capabilities. One of many opinions that must be taken into consideration before you can sucessfully play the role of an architect on a project.
The persons who supply the best third party opinion are clients/users of your projects, aren't they?
Ultimately, this is an issue of acedemia vs experience. Earning a degree doesn't "necessarily" make you a scholar. It is
one measure that tested your capability in one way. Unfortunately, employer's can't just look at you and know you're good. Talking to you during the course of few interviews is going to give them a complete picture either. So gathering degrees, experience, and yes...certifications gives them a number of "points of data" to evaluate you. Just like in statistics, chances are the answer will be better (...more acurate) with more "points of data" to evaluate.
That's right. But, currently, experience overweights all other "points of data", including certifications.
Alex
SCJP, SCJD, SCWCD, SCBCD, SCEA, IBM Certified Enterprise Developer, WebSphere Studio V5.0
Byron Estes<br />Sun Certified Enterprise Architect<br />Senior Consulant<br />Blackwell Consulting Services<br />Chicago, IL<br /><a href="http://www.bcsinc.com" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">www.bcsinc.com</a>
Originally posted by Rufus Bugleweed:
Alex, if you could go back in time would you not do the SCEA certificate? What would you suggest in its place?
[ August 22, 2002: Message edited by: Rufus Bugleweed ]
Originally posted by Arfoo Huang:
-- What do you mean "loosing"? It was better and tougher? Why the most "elite" before?
-- It is not so hard for some people but very hard for some others, such as me. Pass it with the experience or the education. I don't see any problem with that. Knowledge can be gained from education, sometimes even more efficient and comprehensive.
-- True for only some people. For example, it was easy for me.
-- By the way, it's just an exam focusing on ARCHITECTING but not requirement analysis and design. Also many J2EE patterns are based on or composed of the 23 patterns. What I mean is: you're right, they are not wrong. Of course, it will be better if there is a major in the university called "JAVA ARCHITECT".
-- Not perfect. But diagrams partially show the architecture issures.
-- Very good point. But not easy for Sun to do that. Communicating with the candidate more costs more.
-- I guess that is because you passed it "without studying". I am going to spend 6 months for this certification. I think I'll be proud of it when I get it. Just like other certificates I got. It helped me learn a lot of things.
-- You are really good. Hope you tell us more on how to learn from the architect role to pass the exam.
-- I don't think many people here have as much experience as you. It takes much longer for many people. How long it takes you downloaded and submitted the project?
-- You are right. But will it help if you got this certificate before you took the architect role?
--By the way, I really appreciate you give us all the information. I come to this web site several times a day recently to try to get more information on the exam. Just wondering if I should take the exam after read your message.
Please give us more opinions. Any information could be very helpful.[/QB]
scwcd, scjd, scjp<br /><a href="http://natejohnson.us" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">http://natejohnson.us</a><br /><a href="http://rice.kuali.org" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">http://rice.kuali.org</a>
Originally posted by flying jordan:
so. alex, I am now confused by your points. You said you are only 23 years old. I assume you have a Bachelor degree at least, so 23-22=1.
You have one year real world experience , plus some internship maybe ? And you understand that people can't be an architect unless they have few years solid developer experience, etc. So, at this point, why do you need a more difficult and more tough SCEA ? Even there is such a thing and
you get it, it doesn't help you at all based on your age and experience. So, I guess you are worrying soemthing you are not supposed to worry at this moment, maybe you should worry about it in a few years.
The real wrong idea is to expect a get architect job with JUST a SCEA certificate. The ONLY way you can get an architec is you have some architec experience, or as you said, a number of years of solid developer. SCEA is always a supplemental.
Originally posted by James Liu:
[QB]Hi Alex,
You are 23 and you have 7 years experience in IT field, are you kidding me? Based on what you just said, you have a full time job when you went through the whole four years ( or more) in the university, what kind of school is it?
If everything you said it is true, then you are really a genius, off course this certificate is useless for you, and most of us here are just normal guys, this is why we can not understand you, this is why we still think this certificate is useful for our careers.
Originally posted by Alex Pisarev:
Cisco?
Originally posted by flying jordan:
Oh Alex, 7 years of full time experience. so you started that "from afternonn to midnight, plus weekend" working life when you were 16 years old, and you keep a 8:30--2pm school life ? And you said it is normal in Russia ?
I will say: if you are a genius, this type life style would have killed your talent. Einstein said: "Imagination is much more important than knowledge". AT age of 16, it is time for people
to explore, to think, to dream, not just work... This type of life is totally unhealthy. It may create some excellent knowldgeable and very skillful IT developer/architects, but it does no good to genius, like you (here I assume you are).
Mila
Seid Myadiyev<br />SCJP, SCWCD, SCBCD, SCEA-Part 1
In the meantime, my cat is playing with my Programmer's Developer's, and Architect's lapel pins.
Originally posted by Mila Donkova:
Hi Alex,
I don't think SCEA certification loses its prestige.
I am ashamed to say I am doing my project more than 6 months already but I am getting new knowledges every day and it makes me happy. When I started the project I thougth it would take not more than 2-3 weeks to finish it.
All this time I followed this forum discussions. I really enjoyed your and Gennady Shapiro threads and found that you are very smart and competent individual. I think your OOAD knowledge and experience deserve the highest mark as well as your writing and polemic skills. Starting your
own business is very doubtful thing. Wasting time waiting while someone entrust you really great project is difficult for you too.
Do what you really like!
I would suggest to become some of the guys who writes the books for us like Mr. Fowler, Mr. Ambler, or Mr. Cade.
I feel you could succeed on this field.
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