Win a copy of The Little Book of Impediments (e-book only) this week in the Agile and Other Processes forum!
  • Post Reply
  • Bookmark Topic Watch Topic
  • New Topic

Entry-Level Architect -- oxymoron or believable?

 
Marc Peabody
pie sneak
Sheriff
Posts: 4727
Mac Ruby VI Editor
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
I'm not looking for a heated debate or anything, I just want a few honest opinions. Thanks for any insight you share.
Here goes...
Is it really fair for someone with little to no professional experience in J2EE to get certified as an architect? It would be like skipping law school and just taking the bar exam, wouldn't it?
Does such a certification REALLY qualify someone to call themselves an architect? Or does it take years of application design and development to truly possess the knowledge to deserve such a status? Is the test and assignment really so difficult that only the elite can pass?
 
Terry Wang
Ranch Hand
Posts: 102
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
no, i don't think anyone can survive as a real architect with only limited j2ee expr and the paper. BUT, this cert does lead you to think like an architect in your job(even you're not yet), you'll find this helpful in designing/developing systems. this is just like the dba cert, as a developer using database everyday, having a dba cert won't hurt.
 
Marc Peabody
pie sneak
Sheriff
Posts: 4727
Mac Ruby VI Editor
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
Good point, An. So the cert is good no matter what but wouldn't be enough to let a professionally inexperienced Java junkie tread water as an architect.
Anyone have anything to add to that?
 
Kevin Thompson
Ranch Hand
Posts: 237
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
Yes I have something to add to that! Your definition and concept of "architect" is way too high!
I know some architects who know squat. It means they have no real job duties, they just get to walk around drinking coffee and telling people how smart and wonderful they are. It is all sort of "just pretending" to know something.
Did you see the movie "Catch Me If You Can"? It is sort of like that! People can self-label as an international airline pilot, emergency medical doctor, or prosecuting attorney.
Or a "Java Architect".
Here is how you can expose the pretenders from the real ones;
Ask this question:
Have you ever actually coded ANYTHING in java that somebody actually USED somewhere?
You will find that many of the self-described architects get a blank stare on their face.
Kevin
 
Aju Bangalore
Greenhorn
Posts: 15
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
Simple thing is Architect exam helps become an architect. so is programmer/developer exams..
You have to other things too...like solve real life problem..
 
Marc Peabody
pie sneak
Sheriff
Posts: 4727
Mac Ruby VI Editor
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
Apparently, not all people with a job title of "architect" necessarily knows much of anything. I naively assumed that any posers would get weeded out.
I don't understand how anyone could get hired as an architect without having to proove proficiency... maybe that's just how life works.
 
Ajith Kallambella
Sheriff
Posts: 5782
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
In real life the job responsibilities are much more well defined than the broad term "architect". In of the companies I have worked for, I have seen two different architect positions.
The System architect - who is responsible for overall system structure, deployment, app servers, web servers, clustering configurations, database hosts, network stuff, security etc. This is someone I call technology architect or sometimes infrastructure architect. This person understands the big picture, but by no means a person focussed in any one of the abovesaid areas. Breadth of exposure to various areas is more imporant for this role than detailed understanding of any one particular aspect of the system architecture.
The application architect - one who designs overall app development strategy, choses the frameworks, develops blueprints, evaluates various products and technologies for feasibility, works across functional app development teams. This person is also responsible for performance engineering, application components and understands the repertoire of tools and facilities offered by a technology platform. He makes and owns technology directives and leads the team towards a mature, robust, scalable architecture that meets the overall system expectations. An SCEA with a decent number of years of "hands on" Java experience will probably fit into this bucket.
Hope this helps,
 
Marc Peabody
pie sneak
Sheriff
Posts: 4727
Mac Ruby VI Editor
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
I assume when I see "Java Architect" on a job posting, they are about always refering to an "application architect".
 
Ajith Kallambella
Sheriff
Posts: 5782
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
Yes, SCEA and "java architect" are synonymous with "application architect". If you see skillsets that include Unix admin, network admin, shell scripting skills, app server admin etc then they are probably talking about "sytem architect".
 
  • Post Reply
  • Bookmark Topic Watch Topic
  • New Topic