• Post Reply
  • Bookmark Topic Watch Topic
  • New Topic

Certification validity? Why?

 
HanMing Low
Ranch Hand
Posts: 196
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
Hi,
I just received my SCEA certificate and it states that my certificate only valid till 31 March 2005.
Is this a new ruling in Sun?
Why is this so?
What will happen to my certification after that?
I pay $1000 Singapore Dollar just for a 2 year certification, that's S$500 per year!!!
Does anyone know what's the rationale behind this?
I must say that I'm upset.

Looks forward to any advice.
Cheers.

Han Ming
 
Eduard Manas
Ranch Hand
Posts: 69
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
The rational is that in that way Sun earns more money!
 
Barry Gaunt
Ranch Hand
Posts: 7729
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
Some where in this long FAQ it explains the policy.
 
Ajith Kallambella
Sheriff
Posts: 5782
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
You can read more about the recertification policy here
http://suned.sun.com/US/certification/register/recertification.html
Read the section titled "SUN SERVICES RECERTIFICATION"
http://suned.sun.com/US/certification/faq/
Recertification is not a new concept - AFAIK almost all of the Microsoft certificattions expire in two years. Same is true for Novell and Cisco certifications. On one hand it increases revenue for the vendor and on the other, it helps you keep your credentials "current" with technological advancements specific to your area of competence.
There are some good things about Sun's program -
  • Sun is presently offering the recertification exams at a lower cost than the original exam fee. Recertification exams presently cost USD$100 per exam.

  • - This means you will not be spending as much as you already have!
  • Sun does not presently plan to revoke certification titles already held by a professional if the validity date of a specific certification has passed. The validity date serves as a flag for certificate holders to plan their professional growth.

  • - So your certification doesn't really expire!
  • Sun will make every effort to create a single upgrade exam fulfill the requirement for earning certification on the latest version of a technology or job role.

  • - this means you don't have to deal with the whole nine yards again by taking all three tests. Just one test will be enough.

    Cheers,
     
    HanMing Low
    Ranch Hand
    Posts: 196
    • Mark post as helpful
    • send pies
    • Quote
    • Report post to moderator
    Hi,
    Thanks for all the reply.
    I think I do understand that you need to upgrade to keep yourself current.
    But I think surely there is a better way of handling this.
    Imagine you apply for a job with this "expired" certificate, how can we expect a manager or human resource guy to understand it's not really expired?
    If Sun says that this cert is for J2EE 1.3 and need to take an upgrade for J2EE 1.4, I can understand that.
    But printing on the cert that say it valid only until Mar 2005.
    Wow, that's obviously saying that if you don't upgrade on Mar 2005, you can throw away your present one because anyone not paying attention to this policy would regard your cert as invalid.
    Just my 2 cents opinion.
    Cheers.

    Han Ming
     
    Eduard Manas
    Ranch Hand
    Posts: 69
    • Mark post as helpful
    • send pies
    • Quote
    • Report post to moderator
    Han Ming,
    I don't know in the US, but in the UK few employers will give you a job just on the basis that you are certified (if any!). They just hire you from your CV and knowledge, and if you are a certified J2EE architect that's just a bonus, but nothing else.
    I take the certification as a personal achievement and as an 'excuse' of learning/specialising in new technologies. Who would start studying day in day out after work without a clear objective at the end of the road? I wouldn't.
    From my point of view I don't think it is worth repeating the certification just with the idea that it will give you jobs, because it won't!
    My advise would be repeat it only if you feel like in two years time. If you don't, don't worry as Sun says they won't remove your 'Sun Certified Enterprise Architect' title.
    Eduard
     
    Ajith Kallambella
    Sheriff
    Posts: 5782
    • Mark post as helpful
    • send pies
    • Quote
    • Report post to moderator
    I agree with Eduard.
    A certificate, even assuming that it is still current, is hardly accepted as the only proof of your competence. Let's not forget hundreds( if not thousands ) of Java gurus out there who are not certified : :roll: and don't think it's a big deal!
    As long as one doesn't stop reading after passing the test( ), and can get the job done, getting the recertification is purely a personal venture.
     
    HanMing Low
    Ranch Hand
    Posts: 196
    • Mark post as helpful
    • send pies
    • Quote
    • Report post to moderator
    Hi,
    Oh-oh, guess I sound too serious in the event.

    Yes, I do understand that certification means nothing to secure a job.
    I don't put any title of the certification I have passed on my signature and name card too.
    And, I do very much agree that continual learning has a very important role to play.
    However, maybe, it's just in Singapore.
    It certainly doesn't look good, here, to show someone else an "expired" cert.
    I do understand Sun will not expire the title, maybe I have over-reacted.
    I'm sorry if anyone is offended.
    Cheers.


    Han Ming
     
    Ajith Kallambella
    Sheriff
    Posts: 5782
    • Mark post as helpful
    • send pies
    • Quote
    • Report post to moderator
    Originally posted by HanMing Low:
    I do understand Sun will not expire the title, maybe I have over-reacted.
    I'm sorry if anyone is offended.


    No! you did not overreact and certainly has not offended anyone. I think it is not such a big deal to worry about and that's exactly what we were trying to convince you.
     
    Rattan Mann
    Ranch Hand
    Posts: 44
    • Mark post as helpful
    • send pies
    • Quote
    • Report post to moderator
    Dear Low,
    You passed the exam this month. May be within 2 years you will be at such a senior post that nobody would ask you to update your exam.So enjoy your acheivement at least for the next 2 years.
    Rattan
     
    Matt Cao
    Ranch Hand
    Posts: 715
    • Mark post as helpful
    • send pies
    • Quote
    • Report post to moderator
    Hello,
    I think Low has the legit concern because it is very common practice in the dense populations country. Have an extra edge is much better than just edge, very hustle life indeed. In US the labor market seems to follow that direction.
    As long as, you have your current job is OKay. Whatever your extra credential only give you what, a 1% raise, or happy that you save this Friday. Low worries about the next step, the next job.
    It is OK for everyone feels a little bit tense these days.

    Regards,
    MCao
     
    Al Newman
    Ranch Hand
    Posts: 716
    • Mark post as helpful
    • send pies
    • Quote
    • Report post to moderator
    I read through the entire section on recertification and it seems reasonable to me.
    You have to swot up on the new technology every two years and take a $100 exam for each of your certifications. You apparently don't need to go through the project and the essay again.
    I think it's a given to stay current. I just passed my SCJP 1.4 but two years from now they will be on the 1.6 version and the current cert will no longer be the advantage it is now.
    If you don't want to do it Sun isn't going to make you by requiring you to recertify. Though it makes sense to, as the recertification exams seem to be exclusively between serial versions (i.e. 1.2 to 1.4). So it makes sense to keep up to date rather than slipping to the point where you have to do the entire thing over again....
     
    Adeel Ansari
    Ranch Hand
    Posts: 2874
    • Mark post as helpful
    • send pies
    • Quote
    • Report post to moderator
    I am with, Low, here. Expiry date just sounds non sense to me. A certification date and exam version was sufficient enough to imply the thing. Its a money making strategy and nothing else. I don't think they will make much out of it. They might have noticed that nobody or very few appears for an upgrade and they need to force them to do so. Therefore, they come up with this lame plan.

    I have done my SCJP 1.4, and OCP DBA 8, and I believe these titles clearly stating that I need to upgrade, no expiry is needed. And by the way, as far as I know, folks don't want to grab a cert which seems to have an expiry date.

    Could anyone tell me that is this expiry thingie also applied to SCJP, SCJD, SCWCD, SCBCD, or SCWSD? If this is not the case then the whole thing will start making sense a bit.
     
    Hong Anderson
    Ranch Hand
    Posts: 1936
    • Mark post as helpful
    • send pies
    • Quote
    • Report post to moderator
    Adeel, you should take a look at last reply date.
     
    Adeel Ansari
    Ranch Hand
    Posts: 2874
    • Mark post as helpful
    • send pies
    • Quote
    • Report post to moderator
    Kengkaj Sathianpantarit wrote:Adeel, you should take a look at last reply date.


    Oh... Sorry. Actually, somebody pointed me to this. I guess, he himself didn't really pondered over the date.
     
    • Post Reply
    • Bookmark Topic Watch Topic
    • New Topic