SCEA Benefits

[Joe Hollow]

Hi all,

I'm curious to find out exactly what the benefits are of following the Sun certified Enterprise Architect exam. I've covered a number of the API's in varying degrees of detail, built various enterprise application using JEE technology along with more lightweight technology. I'm really looking for a reason why I should take up the exam, what exactly other people have found beneficial from the study and rationale for persuading senior management why they should invest in certified architect exams. It's not hard to convince someone that the Sun Certified Programmers exam is beneficial for all new employees, but the certified architects exam is a little more difficult. Exactly what skills can be learned from pursuing the study and taking the exam as opposed to learning open source frameworks and technology ad hoc in preparation for ongoing development?

Many thanks,
Joe.

[Joe Hollow]

One other question, there seems to be a distinct lack of up to date books on the certified architects exam, especially relating to J2EE 5.0. The Head First book is some way off...if at all viable.

Does it make more sense to have an open curriculum for such as course and expect people to investigate topics and material based on this? Is this more inline with what a solutions architect would expect to do in a real world scenario. Seems so.

Would be interested to hear people's views on this...

[Ronald Wouters]

... what the benefits are of following the Sun certified Enterprise Architect exam

For me personally, the benefits are not in taking the exam because that's a lot of stress Besides the exam is just the "endpoint" of this "service" For me, it is the road you take getting there and the experience gained along the way that is important.
The APIs are one thing. Getting hands on experience in creating and documenting an architecture (using UML), getting a feel for the flow from requirements model, to architecture and design models, and all the different "artifacts" an architect is supposed to deliver, that's were the real benifits are !
Of course, having SCEA on your resume never looks bad either
[ June 17, 2008: Message edited by: Ronald Wouters ]

[Alaa Nassef]

OK, the answer is pretty simple. Certification is a proof that you know the subject(s) that the certification covers. Basically, SCJP is a proof that you know basic java, and this is important for all java developers. SCWCD proves that you know java for the web, which is important for web developers. Similarly SCEA shows that you have knowledge about all java technologies, and that if you need to lay an architecture/design of an enterprise system, you can do it. If you're just a junior developer, I believe that it's going to be tough to convince management of supporting you to take SCEA. If you have the role of an architect, I guess that you can easily convince your management to do that.

[Jimmy Clark]

Similarly SCEA shows that you have knowledge about all java technologies, and that if you need to lay an architecture/design of an enterprise system, you can do it.

I disagree. The old version of SCEA tested you on enterprise architecture design. The new SCEA questions do not access the knowledge required to design enterprise architecture. Deciding whether to use Swing or JSF is not an architectural decision. Choosing between using a Singleton or Abstract Factory design pattern is not an architectural decision.

There are very few questions that concern decisions involving non-technical system requirements such as capacity planning, failover strategies, load balancing, heap management and CPU analysis, etc.

See Review of new SCEA exam

Disclaimer: The Sun Microsystems Certification Marketing team may disagree with my analysis.
[ June 17, 2008: Message edited by: James Clark ]

[Jon Ferguson]

I think I agree with Ronald that the route to the goal is probably the most important part. However, it is nice to show you've done the work.

James' comments on the difference between old and new exams is interesting.. I'm wondering why the new approach? Thinking about it though, how do you measure architectural ability in a multiple choice type exam? Does anyone have a handle on Part II? That's supposed to be project based exam - has it changed significantly?

[Jimmy Clark]

Thinking about it though, how do you measure architectural ability in a multiple choice type exam?

Good point. An individual's particular "ability" may not easily be measured via multiple choice questions. However, a person's "knowledge" can certainly be measured ... with good questions. Ability is then measured in Part II.

Questions about "enterprise architecture" would make the exam more difficult and possible less "Java/Sun like". More difficult for both exam creators and exam takers. The result: less people get the certification, smaller profits for Prometric and Sun. With an easier exam: more people get the certification, increase in profits for Prometric and Sun.

I imagine that, at a global level, there are more application developers than enterprise architects. Modifying the objectives to better suit the larger audience makes good business sense.
[ June 17, 2008: Message edited by: James Clark ]

[Sz Mihai]

The SCEA Benefits can be seen from different point of views:

1) as Certification Seller: pure commercial reasons, sell a product
- give something (knowledge) to take something (finally more money than invested to give)
- build marketing strategies based on customer's needs, all human needs are mostly based on feelings

2) as Certification Buyer: buy something that you thing/feel helps you
(some reasons to buy the product and take the exam)
- it's cool to be certified
- it's required by an employer
- it's a good way to get started with a new techonology, methodology etc.
- you have experience and you need a constant proof of your capabilities
- you don't have experience and you need to proof your capabilities

Conclusions:
1) if you think that smoking, taking drugs, shaved heads etc. are cool then you need this Certification too
2) if your current/future employer's eyes likes big names on papers, because he can't certify your knowledge, you need this Certification
3) if you have clients from 1&2 type, take this exam too, and as many as you can or ..invest the money in a better business area
4) if you don't know nothing about the SUN's view of being an Architect (based mostly on their technologies) ..follow the exam objectives, and ..goto Conclusions_1

Anyway if you don't practice you will quickly forget most of all details required to take the exam. And this will happen with all normal people that need to carry more and more information in its head, usefull information at a given moment or for a limited period of time.
Would be a good thing to see how many people that took this SCEA actually used the knowledge or the acronyms (SCEA certification paper) one year after they took the exam.

For my current needs "the price" reason to not buy is stronger than "proof of current knowledge 'ones for all'" reason (benefits) to buy the product.
This may change after a period of time, of course, maybe then ..SCEA 7 will be out.

[Sz Mihai]

After clicking "Submit" it came in my mind a question:
"Why i'm SCJP?"
Answer: just one friend had an voucher that had 2 weeks before expiration date and ..half price .
Half week ..find study guides/notes, one week I read study guides (1-2 h / day), half week took some practice exams (2 exams per day, payed of course ...) finally ..88% and no major benefits than after 100 pushups, the exam injected adrenaline and happiness that "i'm certified".
At the office, I was so happy that finally i'm certified that ..5 coleague were starting to learn to get certified. After 1 month 4 were not learning for any exam anymore, one that had the voucher to expiry in 2 months, finally took the exam after one study month, because I told him that is so easy to not fail.
So the SUN will always balance the exam's impact on it's customers (to have clients).

Hm, now i'm thinking, that if I will winn a free SCEA 5.0 Training Lab copy then I should take the exam because at least ...is a sign (i hope that "sign" have same meaning in english too, as it has in romanian).

Ups, it's too late, to bed now!

[Changski Tie Zheng Zhang]

For me, it's a milestone.

[chris zielinski]

Originally posted by James Clark:


I disagree. The old version of SCEA tested you on enterprise architecture design. The new SCEA questions do not access the knowledge required to design enterprise architecture. Deciding whether to use Swing or JSF is not an architectural decision. Choosing between using a Singleton or Abstract Factory design pattern is not an architectural decision.

James, I disagree with your view point.. What you say makes it sound like the focus of SCEA is Part 1 (with the objective questions)

The real crux of SCEA is the part 2 with the high level design tasks. Part 1 just gives a broad technology base to the architecture tasks..

[Jimmy Clark]

What you say makes it sound like the focus of SCEA is Part 1 (with the objective questions)

The real crux of SCEA is the part 2 with the high level design tasks. Part 1 just gives a broad technology base to the architecture tasks..

The high-level design for the assignment only briefly touches "enterprise architecture" with the requirement "Create a deployment diagram".

There is a difference between object-oriented design and enterprise architecture design. Class, component, sequence dieagrams cover OO design, not architecture design.