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SCWCD Industry Value

 
jorge zapata
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Hello all, thanks in advance for the replys!
I am wondering how valuable this exam is in the industry during hard economic times. Sure it can't hurt to have on the resume, but what do hiring and IT managers feel about the exam? I am considering taking it. I do have a good amount of JSP/Servlet knowledge, don't have the API's memorized however. I am limited on time so I am debating whether my time is worth while on the exam during this economy. Thanks for any feedback,
Jorge
 
Al Newman
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Hard to say. I live in London and I see quite a few job reqs with Sun certifications as a plus or even required. It can make the difference between getting the interview or not I think, which means that it is worth doing. Especially if you are unemployed.
Down the road it will be an advantage. The certifications tend to establish that you know at least a minimum, and if you can back that with experience it could get you considered for some thing which you would not be.
I think it helps with self-confidence also. I pretty much know going into an interview today that I won't fail the tech interview. Which helps.
YMMV
 
Anonymous
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Jorge,
A good question.
Check out my $0.02 on the matter: May 1st posting on another thread, 2nd paragraph in particular.
Another couple cents...
I agree with Alfred 100%. I've done a good amount of web tier development, but it has all been within Struts. The study needed for the SCWCD has provided a load of insight. There are lots of things taken for granted in Strutsland (a good thing -- we just focus on the business and UIs).
If pressed in a job interview, there are facets of the web tier that I would not have been able to comment on intelligently prior to the SCWCD exercise, despite having crafted several large UI-intensive webapps to date.
The better understanding provided by undertaking the SCWCD helps when pressed to provide more enlightened responses (to interviewer or client), and makes me a stronger web tier developer overall.
Your question seemed job hunting-oriented. If all things were equal between you and another candidate, the SCWCD could be what's needed to tip the scales. Or, if it comes down to a discussion of salary, the SCWCD proves that you already have an education that the new employer doesn't have to pay for (reduced learning curve).
[ May 05, 2003: Message edited by: Erick Reid ]
[ May 05, 2003: Message edited by: Erick Reid ]
 
John Lee
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as far as i know, there is no value in industry. have you seen any ad looking for scwcd? but, through studying for scwcd, i am sure you can learn many things, to improve your value to emplyer.
just my 2 cents!
 
Al Newman
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as far as i know, there is no value in industry. have you seen any ad looking for scwcd? but, through studying for scwcd, i am sure you can learn many things, to improve your value to emplyer.

Right now is too early to assess a quantifiable value to a certification, because there still exists significant unemployment among Java programmers. Later on when the job market improves certifications can and will help one earn more. Right now they can help you find or keep a job.
A SCWCD may or may not raise your earnings, but it helps you quantify what you know when you are marketing your skills. Certifications raise your confidence level in a tough interview and increases your general level of knowledge.
As Eric mentioned they show a level of comittment or dedication to your field. Everything else equal I'm going to talk to certified people before uncertified people. It can be a strong tie-breaker in the winnowing process, particularly with recruiters and actually getting into the first interview.
Right now it's a numbers game. No matter how good you are the chances are that you'll bodge one or more interviews before hitting. What the certs do is give you a good chance of getting more interviews more quickly....
There are of course other things involved. The SCWCD is getting long in the tooth, and I would wish to see evidence that the candidate has been keeping up with Struts and other things. People have to do well in the interview and be able to communicate.
 
Pradeep Chopra
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Dear Jorge,
People have appropriately answered your question and I support them!
I would like to quote couple of lines from my SCJP 1.4 article. Although it is generalized statement but being into this Industry for last couple of years, I strongly believe in it.
One of the less-appreciated values of IT certification is the experience itself. Studying for the SCJP (same applies to SCWCD) exam is a very structured way to learn about the Java language (i.e. JSP Servlets in case of SCWCD), which is quite different from the day-to-day experience of programming for a living. Coming out of the exam, you could find that you have a more detailed understanding of how the Java language works and that, as a result, your overall Java programming skills are much improved.
You may want to read more on it at http://www.whizlabs.com/certifications.html
Hope this inspires you a bit!
Regards and best wishes,
Pradeep
 
Anonymous
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there is no value in industry

heck, there is scant value even here at my present work. i'm not undertaking the certs for their sake -- it's all about my being enlightened about the web tier, etc.
interestingly, a number of colleagues here at work have recently been asking for my cert books so they too can dig in. they've seen me go from groping somewhat blindly around in struts several months ago to being able to converse intelligently on session management, thanks in no small part to the scwcd exercise.
one of our hardcore server-side architects is keen about taking the scwcd himself. he admits that despite knowing about ejbs, transactions, legacy integration and the like, he is quite green about what it takes to bring that power to the client.
if you go into an interview with a "hire me for i am certified" attitude -- you'll probably get schooled. i've been asked many many times why go after certs here when the bosses here tend to poo-poo them. it's all about enlightenment -- which carries a great deal of industry value.
[ May 08, 2003: Message edited by: Erick Reid ]
 
Anonymous
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p.s. Pradeep -- I read your articles and saved them for further consideration. I'll be taking the SCEA on next. Thanks for the resource.
[ May 08, 2003: Message edited by: Erick Reid ]
 
Al Newman
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It's about becoming a guru! It's a goal which you never reach of course.
there is no value in industry

No industry value.... Hmmm. Let's not forget that we're living in interesting economic times. Interesting in the Confucian sense. The market for technical talent is as bad as it has been for at least 20 years. Assuming that we're not permanently obsolete I think we can assume that the market will come back. If not to the levels seen in 1999 or 2000 (which was crazy), then to the levels between 1994 and 1998.
Does being knowledgable pay off in normal times? You bet it does, both in dollars and in status. Also job security. Normally you cannot hire true gurus for love or money. Today you can. There are gurus looking for work, but that is never going to last.
they've seen me go from groping somewhat blindly around in struts several months ago to being able to converse intelligently on session management, thanks in no small part to the scwcd exercise.

Yes. The SCWCD curriculum is an encapsulation of what Sun saw as Web tier best practices as of 18 months ago or so. The web-tier world has moved on somewhat but everything is still built on servlet and JSP. You could look at the SCWCD as Struts internals. And its good for people to know the internals. If nothing else you can blow the managers away in conversation. ;-)
one of our hardcore server-side architects is keen about taking the scwcd himself. he admits that despite knowing about ejbs, transactions, legacy integration and the like, he is quite green about what it takes to bring that power to the client.

I come from that direction myself, and decided to do the SCWCD myself because a) web-tier implementation/architecture was on my learning-list and B) the SCWCD was there and some of the other certifications aren't as advanced. Yet. Maybe C ) I need a job and there is a lot of demand for web-tier these days.
[ May 08, 2003: Message edited by: Alfred Neumann ]
 
boyet silverio
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form Erick Reid:
...it's all about enlightenment...

Coudn't have said it best.
 
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