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Enthuware Software Support
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Ajith,
You are quite prompt in requesting the users to have proper name. May I request you to request users not to just-keep-on- pumping questions without even spending a minute trying to understand them?
-Paul.
 
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I couldn't agree more. The tool for learning is making one's own mistakes
Travis M. Gibson
(Future SCJP - Nov. 19, 2000)
 
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I hope you will first issue a gentle warning!
I think all of us get carried away once in a while and do post messages before checking.
Don't overdo it, please.
 
Greenhorn
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I couldn't resist myself from not posting a reply to this post. I feel, that some of the posts/replies in this forum are becoming too rude, or unprofessional by pointing fingers at others. And some posts, the language becomes very offending. This is not healthy for the forum itself.
I have posted very few questions here in this forum, but i have been reading posts/replies to this forum for the last one month. I like this forum as a learning tool. For one of my posts I got a reply, saying like "why don't you test it before posting it here". It had discouraged me to some extend from posting further doubts here which are very genuine. As an eager to learn developer, first thing we all will do is write the code in doubt and test it and unless and until we have a valid reason to post it, most of us won't post it here.
There could be exceptions to this, but most of us who are so busy in life and have better things to do won't take pleasure in just posting a message and wasting others' time(just of the sake of posting).
I hope atleast few people in this forum will agree to this. Let us stick to our goal (Learn Java !!!) not anything else.
Thanks,
 
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Hi folks,
hmmm, this discussion is an interesting one. I would say that nobody has problems with people starting in java and having questions about some basics. I read very basic questions here and a lot of people answered very patiently. And that's okay, i would say, this is the main focus of javaranch. As you notice, i wrote javaranch and not this forum. For the pure beginners, which have no clue about java and start from scratch, there is an other forum, where they can post really basic question. Don't get me wrong, i don't have any problems to help people in basic questions.
BUT i have a problem with people taking questions from mock exams and just posting them to the forum without even trying to solve them. If i read a question like "wut statement is true about" and then something with layout managers or so follows, no problem.
BUT questions about which of the following a valid identifiers, i can't understand, why someone have to post this. You can get JDK for free, and you can just test it. The compiler will tell you in most cases wut's wrong.
cheers
Oliver
 
Paul Anilprem
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I'm sorry if I discouraged you in anyway, Jayamani. Frankly, what prompted me to post this thread was tons of posts by a particular person. He just copied and pasted all the questions , literally, from a book. I mean, did not even take pains to type them out!!! Of course, this is an open discussion place and anybody can post whatever he/she likes but do you think this is a good practice?
-Paul.

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I know exactly what you are talking about and I couldn't agree with you more. I call it "spoon-feeding" - the attitude people get used to when they can get the answer for any question just by asking it. I don't think you folks are alone in feeling such a way. Just browse through the posts in the forum and look at the ones which has ZERO replies. You know why they remain unanswered
If you have been visiting this forum you will know not more than three questions a day is really worth reading. The others are usually is this true or false? or What is RHE? or Will this code compile without errors kind of questions. I have tried in the past and will continue to do so in the future, to discourage people from asking very obvious questions. After all, SCJP is not the end of the game. Eventually one is expected to write programs independently. Many people don't bother to read through the old posts, or use the search facility or read the JavaRanch FAQ and new Certification FAQ. I don't want to discourage people from asking questions, but at the same time I want to remind them they should where to look for answers or how to deduce one themselves by writing some code.
In the past people have reacted with contempt for such discouraging comments. Many don't understand the real spirit behind a suggestion which says - why don't you try on your own, can't you download the JDK and compile your code??. Sometimes I do try to answer a very basic question and then close the thread by moving it to other Java forums like Java in General(beginner) or
Cattle Drive(Java College} or
Java in General(beginner).
Guys, I really appreciate your concern about losing quality of discussions in this otherwise great forum. I will take your suggestion Paul Anil. The BIG issue here is we have to do this without scaring( and chasing ) people away.
Ajith
 
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I agree with your guys about posting question without think about it first. I don't mean to offend anyone, but sometimes, I would see some "stupid questions", they can be solved by simply write a program.
 
Trailboss
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I agree. There are a lot of folks that seem to have this idea that the more experienced folks are paid heaps of money to be their personal slaves. They haven't caught on to the idea that everybody here is a volunteer. (Except me - I pay to be here )
My humble suggestions. When somebody asks a question that they should have run through the compiler: "What happened when you ran it through the compiler?"
When somebody copies a mock exam question and does not provide the answer "what's the answer supposed to be?"
And when they don't provide their answer "What answer do you think it is?"
Or: "Well, a person could damn near write a book on this topic. If you give me an idea of what part is confusing you, I can try to share a sentence or two that will help out."
Remember, JavaRanch is "a friendly place for java greenhorns". Sometimes these guys truly are starting at the very beginning and the whole question throws them for a loop and they don't even know what it is that they don't know. They can't even begin to comprehend the question. Granted, most of the folks that post this sort of thing are just jerks. But the reason you want to answer the question is that if you can teach it, you truly know the material. Plus if you have it wrong, somebody will tell you - and thus you learn even more.
No matter where you go, there are jerks. The wacky thing is that if you get pissed off, they just turn into bigger jerks. If you're consistantly decent, they usually turn into decent folks.

 
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I am so happy to see this thread here...
Gautam,
One request. Just because you might have grasped a concept very well, doesn't mean that everyone has. as a participant in the increament decrement thread, let me say just one thing. trying to answer that question has cleared so many of my doubts, i really feel like thanking the guy who started the thread! Everyone has their own questions and as long as they have at least tried as pual says, its ok. give the person a break. On this issue I thoroughly agree to what Ajith and Paul have said.
Ajith,
Could I make a suggestion? Could we have a new forum called somthing like "Unanswered Questions" and have a question moved there if there is no reply for say three days or so? most of the valid questions do get answered AFAIK. This way someone who does have time, energy, and patience can always be nice enough to do the kind deed for the day and rest of us would be spared bursts of irritation
Shubhangi.
 
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I want to add something to this. I am a SCJP aspirant and I am completely lost at this site/forum(for SCJP). I see there are more than 70 pages in this forum. I think it would take me a lot of time to keep up with this. I strongly believe moderators should step up and delete the posts which have nothing to contribute. Also it would be nice to completely categorize all forums - the way Maha Anna has it. So I can go to a particular place if I am looking for operator related posts or Thread related posts.
 
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I think the argument by Ajith is very valid.Some people get used to Spoon feeding.This forum is run by extremely good and helpful people.But unfortunately some guys take undue advantage of this by asking answers to questions they have not tried out.Some others are here to show-off their (so called) Java skills.I will not take names,but people have given comments like 'I don't think u know such and such topic' when i have tried to help out a third person.
Shubhangi,I agree that some people do have genuine problems.But please try to help yourselves first.Only then can we help you.Ajith has called it right when he says that SCJP is not the final frontier.In the end ur performance matters the most.
I hope this does not discourage anyone who has a genuine problem and needs help.
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