What to do Testing/Programming

[Garry Kalra]

Hi,
I'm in a confused situation, as i have just completed my masters and am looking for a training. I attended an interview and got the training of testing a software product. But i want to know if it will affect my future as i want to do development in java and oracle but i am not getting any chances to do it.
Any suggestions will be appreciated.
Garry

[Ron Moddesette]

If you're desperate for a job, testing may pay the bills. I'd ask about the chances of moving into development from testing.
At my work a few testers have moved to development, but most move on to something else. Testing is a very tedious job and you may want to think long and hard about settling for this position. If possible I'd wait for a development position, because you may get stuck in testing for along time(year+).
I hope this info helped you,
Ron

[Roseanne Zhang]

If I were you, I'll take it. Why?
1) The job market is tough, obviously.
2) At least, you are dealing with software life cycle, and learning (actually a lot). Testing is a science too.
3) There is a will, there is a way. I remember on Marcus's site, there was one person posted his story, he was a tester, but he was writing Java software to automated his testing, and finally became a Java programmer.
4) Of course, you need to motivate yourself enough to do that...

Need Java real project experience Join our project team here!
[This message has been edited by Roseanne Zhang (edited December 11, 2001).]

[Mark Herschberg]

I think testing is good, but you have to be careful. Testign will give you good experience. I wish more programmers had some testing under their belt, because it meakes them better programmers.
However, testing is often viewed as second tier to development. Some hiring managers will view it as a black mark on your resume. I think this view will eventually change in time, but not for another 10-15 years.
Therefore, if you do take a testing job, I would advice you to make it clear from the start that you want to move into development. Lay out a schedule. Understand that he might not be able to commit to an exact date, but get a relatively range, i.e. shoot for, say, 6 months, and put a 9 month cap on it. Also talk about what type of position it would be when you do move. Of course, nothing is ever certain, so understand they still may have layoffs of reneg on the deal.
But with all that, if you're having troubling finding jobs, take this one. Just remember, as with all jobs, take your fate in your own hands, and control your own destiny.

--Mark

[William Barnes]

Without knowing anything about you it is hard to say. Do you have any experience as a programmer? Is this you first real job in a technology field? What is your degree in? Are your expectations, of being a developer, justified?
Learn as much about the job as possible before hand so that you are going in with your eyes open. Is it a large or small company? In a large company you might have a better chance of moving around. Does the company have a formal policy concerning applying for other positions? Is there a set amount of time you would have to spend in the initial position before applying for another?
Good luck and keep as posted.

[John Coxey]

Gary:
If you are graduating with MS-CS in USA - and this was your only job offer - then you should grab it.
While you are at testing job - get the SCJP, UML, EJB exams out of your way. Also, know JSP well enough to get through interview. Let your employer know that you WANT to move into a development role.
Core Java by itself is NOT what makes $$ in this industry - it's the ability to write EJB's & JSP's and coordinate/debug them with today's application servers. I would think 6-12 months as a tester (especially since it's your 1st job) would NOT hurt. I think it would actually HELP. And it's definitely alot better than putting McDonald's on a resume (especially since you have an MS degree).
What you don't want to do is flip burgers for the next 2 years until the market gets better.
--------
So while at testing company, how do you get coding job?
1. Go to lunch with the development teams. Bullpooh on anyone who says that testers cannot do lunch with developers - don't let anyone con you into believing that.
2. From these lunch meetings/chat sessions, you will gain insight into what technologies these folks are using. Most companies advertise internally first for potential openings - again, keep your eyes/ears open. Use this information to stear your studying efforts.
3. When doing testing - you may have access to the source code. Fix the bugs yourself. Keep notes on what you fix - so you can add this to your resume.
4. Even though company has your title defined as a "tester". If you do a good bit of code re-writting - make up your own title and slap that on your resume. Show how you "progressed" from a tester to a bug fixer to a coder.
Once you show folks in the company that you can code - you may get a project dumped in your lap. Now will be your chance to take the ball and run with it. This is where the contact's that you made while doing lunch with the development team will come into play. Now you have some folks that you can bounce ideas off of.
Even is your shop is not doing Java - get the coding experience anyway.
John Coxey
([email protected])

[Roseanne Zhang]

The lunch proposal is good.
I and someone else started a Java Lunch on a large (huge) telecom company cafeteria sometimes ago. It happens every Tuesday, I even made a Java Flag to attract people's attention. It attracted many regular attenders, and I learned a lot from them. This Java Lunch even attracted someone from other companies across the street. Sun specifically invited us for lunch, and sent us books etc.
Both original sponsors left that company, but the Java Lunch still goes on and on there...
When we started that Java Lunch, I was supposed to be a VC++ contractor, and changed my job in a critical project and coded it in Java...
There is a will, there is a way...
Thanks!
Roseanne
Need Java real project experience? Join our project team here!
[This message has been edited by Roseanne Zhang (edited December 11, 2001).]

[Matts Smith]

Hi there,
take the job. I have been on the job market for 3 years and here are the positions I occupied
Web programmer 6 months
Database programmer 3 months
Team-leader (database) 1 year
Consultant A/P (java) 1 year
bottom line: if you are good, you won't stay a tester for long. Nevermind the nay-sayers. everything will fall into place quick enough.