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Microsoft's 200 million stick - .Net

 
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Howdy ranchers,
Contrary to what many of the so-called Java advocates are saying The .Net framework is no joke.
Microsoft who is notorious for letting paying customers debug their software have a 200 million dollar spoon ready to shove down everyone's mouth.
Better open wide.
While the scaling problems with Web Forms(ASP 3.0) still exist with Application objects, the problem seems alot to be fixed with Session objects working across server farms. But EJBs seems to still have some scaling problems as well.

Furthermore the Visual Studio .Net IDE is the best I have ever seen. Now if your a hardcore developer like I me your probably saying vi or emacs is the best tool for writing code. But for everyone except us hardcore type this IDE does everything except cook your dinner.
C# as a language is very nice! Think of everything from C++ you wish you had in Java plus some other stuff and you have C-Sharp.
The key is .Net is so intergrated with Windows you have access to everything you want to do in Windows. From deployment to IIS, One click creation of web services, XML remoting between application or domains, one click creation of Windows service.
Dude you can even use the Windows installer in your code.
In developing GUIs...Swing cannot touch Windows form..PERIOD!
Java has and continues to be my bread and butter but I have just completed a .Net/C# project for a client of mine and I must say I was kind of impressed.
There are still things about Java that Microsoft won't provide, platform-independence being one thing. But in order for Java to fight off .Net Sun must set it free and make it open source. It's the only way.
No, suing Microsoft will not work. How many times must we see the better technology lose out because one technology is marketed better than another(Beta/VHS, Windows/everything else..)
If you love Java, Sun Microsystem then you must let it go.
My 2 pennies..
 
Greenhorn
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I agree with this post. I've been playing around with Java the past year (I even took a couple of classes) with the goal of getting my SCJP but now I'm not going to bother.
The Java market is flooded, and I'd have to take a pay cut. I'm currently a Smalltalk programmer, and I'll bet the Microsoft bandwagon is going to take off. I plan on getting on their bandwagon since I've already missed the Java bankwagon.
Just my 2 cents.
 
Travis Gibson
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I'm not saying to abandon your Java studies only that .Net is no joke.
I haven't even mentioned the XML support built in ADO.NET and Remoting. I still think Web Forms(ASP) could be better but that Code-behind method is sweet. All the power of JSP with Struts except
cleaner
The learning curve for J2EE and EJBs can be kinda steep. When you mix in all the different vendors in that space IBM, Bea, Oracle and each one implementing their own way it can be a nightmare.
As .Net becomes more and more stable thanks to us paying guinea pigs it will become a behemoth. Mark my words!!
Remember Windows 1 - 3.0?? IBM OS and Mac OS were both way better and way more stable but what happened. Windows snatched away damn near every desktop in the world. Win 3.0 used to crash on me at least 3 times a day.
The idea of supporting a Microsoft technology is not an easy pill to swallow.
Java needs to be truly free in order to survive. If Java dies we all lose.
 
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Microsoft knows how to make an IDE. They add productive tools that simplify the creation of Windows based software. Their solution doesn't have to be better, just close and the throngs of VB pseudo-programmers will run to them.
I think one of the side effects of the Java revolution has been greater focus on OO analysis and design. The problem with "Visual" programming is too much code is written and not enough is designed.
I will program in whatever language and on any platform that puts a check in the bank.
 
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Unfortunately in my case i may never get the chance to do a C# project. The company i work for right now was so frustrated with the perennial crash of MS -- thus no one in the company codes in VB anymore(much less C#), and all our MS servers are being phased out. Perhaps by end of this year the company will be MS free. We use unix, linux, oracle, and write code in java and c/c++. More stable system now. Oh, and lower cost.

Maybe on a weekend i'll take a look at the Visual Studio IDE. Hey is there a free download? Cheers.
 
Travis Gibson
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Originally posted by Shawarma Kebab:
Maybe on a weekend i'll take a look at the Visual Studio IDE. Hey is there a free download? Cheers.


Not a snowball's chance in hell.
The Enterprise edition(Which I have) is over $2,000 per licence
The .Net SDK is free though at msdn.microsoft.com
 
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Isn't there a professional version for like ~$200? I think they plan to include Java at some point too don't they?
 
Michael Pearson
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Originally posted by Shawarma Kebab:
Unfortunately in my case i may never get the chance to do a C# project. The company i work for right now was so frustrated with the perennial crash of MS -- thus no one in the company codes in VB anymore(much less C#), and all our MS servers are being phased out. Perhaps by end of this year the company will be MS free. We use unix, linux, oracle, and write code in java and c/c++. More stable system now. Oh, and lower cost.


I wish I worked for a company that saw the truth behind Microsoft's bloatware. A lot of people believe the hype pumped out by Microsoft and wouldn't believe it costs more per desktop to maintain and support.
[ March 13, 2002: Message edited by: Michael Pearson ]
 
Michael Pearson
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Originally posted by Jim Baiter:
Isn't there a professional version for like ~$200? I think they plan to include Java at some point too don't they?


This stuff isn't cheap!
Academic .Net Professional - $115
Upgrade .Net Professional - $449
Upgrade .Net Enterprise Architect - $1675
.Net Enterprise Architect, FULL - $2325
This blows my mind. Could you imagine having to pay $2000 for a J2EE developer license?
 
Travis Gibson
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Originally posted by Michael Pearson:

This stuff isn't cheap!
Academic .Net Professional - $115
Upgrade .Net Professional - $449
Upgrade .Net Enterprise Architect - $1675
.Net Enterprise Architect, FULL - $2325
This blows my mind. Could you imagine having to pay $2000 for a J2EE developer license?


Nope, I didn't have to pay for my copy(My employer picked up the tab)
You still have the choice of using your favorite Text editor. Personally I think IDEs make you lazy developer. You start depending on outcompletion and auto error checking. Instead of either taking the time to research the API or double checking your code before you compile.
But with that said VS.NET Architect does everything accept get you coffee. Take yesterday I was coding some DALs(Data Access Layers) using ADO and I needed to create some stored procedures.
Well you simply click on the DB server that you are using select Add Stored Procedure. Put in the SQL for the stored procedure and save it. Then you can refer to it simply by name in your code without any setup or defining the path to the actual file.
Anyhow all I am saying is .NET is doing somethings right and Sun(And the rest of the Java world) needs to take notice.
 
Michael Pearson
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Originally posted by Travis Gibson:

Nope, I didn't have to pay for my copy(My employer picked up the tab)


My employer does the MSDN subscription, so we've had the Beta and now the licensed version of Visual Studio. Life's really great when you get paid to play with new technology.
 
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