This week's book giveaway is in the Agile and Other Processes forum. We're giving away four copies of Real-World Software Development: A Project-Driven Guide to Fundamentals in Java and have Dr. Raoul-Gabriel Urma & Richard Warburton on-line! See this thread for details.
I know that there have been intensive discussions at the Java Ranch on demanding requirements set by employers these days. I just cannot help posting this job ad that I saw at the JavaJobs.com. In order for me to get a feeling about the scope of responsibility of a junior Java developer, please help me to assess the requirements listed in the ad. See below: ======================================= Posted 02.13.2003 Apply for this opportunity Job Title: Jr Java Developer Location: Denver, CO Job Description: Jr Java/Websphere Developer Looking for a junior java/web developer for a full time, salaried position supporting internal business customers doing maintenance and enhancements to a web-based application. Requirements Ability to deal with all aspects of the product development life cycle from design to debugging and maintenance. Understanding of the object-oriented paradigm, creativity and problem solving. Proficient with J2EE, Java/Web programming including the following skillsets: Core Java Programming, JDBC, Servlets, JSP, EJB, XML, Java Beans, HTML, Java Script preferrably in a Visual Age for Java version WebSphere test environment Preferred, not required: Oracle SQL programming Basic UNIX skills (AIX or Solaris) Preferably Sun certified Java2 Programmer. Knowledge on JTOpen (Java tool kit API used to connect to AS/400 from CoLink) preferred. Good knowledge on WebSphere Studio Application Developer 4.0 Proficient with WebSphere Application Server 4.0 and above. WebSphere installation, administration, application deployment and testing. Knowledge of iPlanet WebServer v 4.7 and above Some PL/SQL skills Knowledge/experience on Source Code control, configuration management skills on any of the tools like Rational Clear Case, VSS, CVS etc. Knowledge of MQ Series is preferred Reply To: email@example.com ====================================
Obviously you can't be a junior developer and have this skill set. Junior just translates to lower pay. The job title should be "Underpaid Java Developer Who Can't Find Anything Better". If you want this job, add this snippet to your cover letter: Objective: Would like to be under-valued at a company that knows when and how to take advantage of a down job market.
Not trying to be a troll, but it looks like it's an employer's market and now it's they're turn to give back what they have been forced to receive which is to pay the ridiculous salaries that were being paid when everything was "great". Great for who? The employees or employers? I remember new graduates (during interviews) expecting pays in the 60K with sign-on bonuses. The kind of salary expectation really skewed it for everyone, because it made it difficult for companies to set a fair salary scale. How can you justify paying an employee that has been with you for 10 years in the 60's or 70's, when you're forced to hire recent college graduates for a little less? IMO, we're reaping what we sow. BTW, when I say we I mean the entire IT industry. Before the entire Internet bubble popped, I bet you CIOs were asking "Are these typical salaries for a Junior Java Developer?"
After reading that job description and sitting in a classroom for a 300/400 level course I can say thats pretty fair. if they are looking for recent graduates they should have touched on all that in their schooling. Will they be proficient? no but with a jr level position I would not think they'd expect it but then again I'm not in the industry anymore. I do know that for the program I graduated from and will soon (god willings) be getting a Master's from you graduate having touched all of these topics if you took the right courses. But I don't know many undergrads that have a keen ear to what the industry trends are (I didn't but I've always said I'm an anamoly). Again its possible to be fresh out of school and match this resume. How proficient you are will come up in the interview and that may be a downfall.
posted 17 years ago
Matt, the problem is the word "proficient". No Jr. programmer is going to be proficient with the list of technologies they have there.
All: - Just reading the post at the top of this discussion list. - I'd just go ahead and fire off a resume. Play the game with these folks. - Hopefully, some HR schmuck was assigned the task of placing the advertisement and it interrupted his/her lunch hour - so they did a quick rush job. Happens more than you think. - In this job market - you do not want to be eliminating potential job opportunities. So I say go for it. The most these ninkompoops (sp?) can say is no. ------------ - What I hate are recruiters (supposedly professionals, yeah right!!!), that post these types of advertisements on dice and monster. - But again, you cannot be selective. If the job mentions Java then fire off a resume. Do the followups and play the game. Never know who might take a bite. John Coxey (firstname.lastname@example.org)
Evansville, Indiana, USA
Are you okay? You look a little big. Maybe this tiny ad will help: