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US Policy and Foreign Workers

 
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Happy New Year Everyone!
I was wondering, from those who are employed, have you noticed a drop in the employment of third-word nationals in the market? I have written my Congressman concerning the flood of third world nationals taking away jobs from Americans. He tells me the ceiling has been lowered by 2/3 of the 2003 figure. If this is so, we should all notice a decline in the number of foreign workers here in the US since the policy went into effect October 2003.
Furthermore, much has been made of the outsourcing going on. I think it is bad. I ask you to recall what manufacturing workers insisted on--identifying built goods in the USA. Congress also became involved and slapped tariffs on imports. The cost was so high, we had foreign companies "assembling goods" in the USA so they could get around the tariffs. In the end, we saw some jobs come back to the manufacturing sector. My personal opinion is we should do the same for software. Enact laws to make companies identify where the product was built. Additionally, we should hold the foreign companies accountable to a coding standard consistent with maintainability and readability. I believe this is where much of the American jobs market for programmers will be--maintaining code for foreign organizations.
Okay, well, I hope this adds to the discussion in some helpful way!

Russ
 
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Even at the reduced cap the number of foreign nationals being allowed to work in the US is a huge increase in the labor pool. IIRC the new allowance is about 60K. In the near recent past the majority of those foreign nationals entering the US were employed in the IT and engineering sectors. So if you divide 60K by 50 states that is 1200 new candidates for business to choose from for a given state.
I live in a particulary average state. I don't have the exact numbers but I doubt the institutions of higher learning in this state turn out much more than 1200 new graduates a year with a BS in Engineering or Comp Sci. Some number of those grads are themselves foreign nationals. Some number of those foreign nationals return to their country of origin.
So the 60K quota effectively doubles the number of potential applicants that are young and naive.
Please write your congresspeople again and tell them it's time to end this travesty.
Tell them you don't mind them doubling the pool if they do it by doubling the number of indigenous people that they put through the educational system. They know that would cost money.
 
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Originally posted by Russ Ray:

He tells me the ceiling has been lowered by 2/3 of the 2003 figure. If this is so, we should all notice a decline in the number of foreign workers here in the US since the policy went into effect October 2003.


Isn't that for the annual number of visas granted? IIRC H1-B's are good for 6 years, so if any given quarter N visas are given out we had a drop from 24N to 23-2/3N. Doesn't seem like that would be noticable. (Or have other rules changed, too?)

Originally posted by Russ Ray:

Additionally, we should hold the foreign companies accountable to a coding standard consistent with maintainability and readability.


Why should foreign companies be held to higher standards than US companies.
The free market does a much better job of protecting against bad choices in this case.

--Mark
 
Russ Ray
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Rufus/Mark:
Mmmmmm. You make an excellent point--6yrs visa. If this is true, this is not good at all!!! This would mean we would not see ANY recovery for programmers!!! I was under the impression this was a one-year term that could be renewed annually. Second of all, is your assertion that all 60,000 H-1B's applicants are software engineers/programmers? I thought this included engineers of all sorts and teachers. Mmmm, obviously, I need more information. However, I would agree with you, that zero is better than 60,000 any day. However, I don't see many of the BIG companies/TELECOs who advocated the visas supporting the zero option. We need to put Americans back to work FIRST, but I think some companies would rather please stockholders with BIG profits than what is morally sound.
I do think collectively we all could send a message to our own Congressman and asking them to eliminate the visas for high-tech workers. I would hope readers would vote their pocketbooks in coming elections concerning this issue. The more we talk in unison, the clearer we are heard. Isn�t that funny; Congress only listens when 1M monkeys yell at them! We need a PAC!!!
I realize my suggestion embarks on the thought of protectionism, but my experience has been some (not all) foreign nationals take short cuts and break OO principles in their development life cycles just to make the project meet milestones for their American clients. This smacks of a sweatshop mentality and is prevalent in operations in under-developed countries where there is little or no labor laws or indigenous workforces where they are happy just to work in America. Remember the Kathy Lee?
My point is the free market consumer should make "sound" choices based on accurate information concerning a product. This is call economic power being applied in a free market. While I do not know this for sure, but I would say much of the software in the market is developed in America. I think the consumer would look differently upon a product developed overseas. It�s kind of a 1,000-mile screwdriver. Furthermore, my point about a uniform standard is applicable to all. My contention is that what is under the covers is no concern to companies until it breaks. This is where the American programmer would have to dive in and "repair" the program. Without uniform standards and sound development documentation, one is left to reading hieroglyphics.
I appreciate everyone�s thoughtful insight. It has aided me immeasurably.
Thanks,
Russ
 
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Originally posted by Russ Ray:
Rufus/Mark:
but my experience has been some (not all) foreign nationals take short cuts and break OO principles in their development life cycles just to make the project meet milestones for their American clients. This smacks of a sweatshop mentality and is prevalent in operations in under-developed countries


And this sentiment smacks of jingoism. I'm sure I can give you examples of some American nationals (again, not all) doing the same thing; and BTW I've worked for American managers who have forced my team to take shortcuts in the development life cycles just to make their projects meet milestones so that they would look good before their managers. This is a very common occurrence in software development life cycle. I've seen in this in my various projects here in the US over the last 12+ years from Chicago to Atlanta to NY to NC to CA to NE etc. And I'm sure the same is true for all other countries too. What I'm trying to say is that it is not fair to blame the quality of or its lack of in the software systems to nationality of the developers.
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