Indian Tech Industry...

[ankur rathi]

Hi,
somebody mailed me this...
how true it is??

 
>
 
> Views on the Indian tech industry
 
>
 
> It's a topic that has been oft debated - that India's tech industry is
 
> a lot like the Chinese manufacturing phenomenon - Low cost, reasonable
 
> quality, minimal innovation. I was an employee of a huge IT company in
 
> India (what the heck, it was TCS) and have, in the two years in their 
 
> employ, developed certain opinions and concerns about the direction of
 
> India's IT revolution.
 
>
 
> Here's how Indian IT companies operate (Infy, TCS, wipro and the
 
> second string such as mastek, satyam, patni etc). Hire engineers in 
 
> bulk, never mind that they are not computer scientists or electrical 
 
> engineers - if they can write a few lines of code in C/C++ and are 
 
> academically decent, they're hired. After all, they dont need 
 
> brilliant engineers - just people who will do as they are told and 
 
> reasonably intelligent enough to get the client's work done, and 
 
> bullshit their way out of it if they don't. They'll rarely make CAD 
 
> software for Electrical engineering or mechanical engineering.
 
> Instead they will develop "end to end solutions" for banking, finance,
 
> inventory management, website development, etc. By develop I mean 
 
> code, not design - there is a huge difference between the two, 
 
> something which I will touch upon shortly. One important thing to note
 
> is that the HR in most IT companies dont give a damn about individual 
 
> interests. They will put you wherever they need someone to slog for 
 
> them. I've had one HR person tell me that they will put me in a 
 
> project where they get maximum money, regardless if I am interested or
 
> not. And they wonder why so many people leave!!!
 
>
 
> What is the nature of the work? At least 70% of the international
 
> projects in most indian IT companies is maintenence - i.e someone else
 
> has already developed an application. All you need to do is add more 
 
> features/change behaviour as per client's request. Then there's 
 
> production support, which is worse. It is almost call-center work - 
 
> ensure that the application runs normally and if it fails, get it up 
 
> and running ASAP. Take calls from the client, update on the status. In
 
> a sense, like a car mechanic - I didnt get an engineering degree to be
 
> a car mechanic - I got it to design the car!
 
> Finally, if you are lucky you get development - write code. But then, 
 
> writing code is easy - it is like manufacturing a car. What is not, is
 
> designing a system that works efficiently. Typically, foreign clients 
 
> get the design done by the likes of Accenture, IBM, etc. The designs 
 
> are then sent to desi companies, who actually do the coding at a cost 
 
> much cheaper than IBM or accenture. Thus, all we do is donkey work. It
 
> is not technology - it is programming. Technology is a new idea, 
 
> paradigm or design - programming is implementing that design. Thus, 
 
> most of the people in IT waste their engineering degrees, doing 
 
> mundane programming, until they are made project managers - after 
 
> which they spend their lives approving timesheets, conducting 
 
> appraisals and sucking up to the client. Wait a second - shouldnt an 
 
> experienced IT professional be doing advanced stuff and leave the 
 
> bullshitting to MBAs?
 
>
 
> Why is it so hard for desi companies to do design? The've not tried
 
> hard enough (yet) to get into this space. They just dont have the 
 
> competence to get the job done. Desi companies are amazing at 
 
> procedure oriented projects - if there is a procedure in place telling
 
> us what to do, we can do it. They dont have the experience (and 
 
> therefore the brand equity) to attract IT consulting projects. 
 
> Consulting is largely a reputation driven business. In order to build 
 
> such a reputation, desi companies need to hire high-flying consulants 
 
> - they dont come cheap. Even after all this, there is no guarantee of 
 
> results! (Lately, Infy is trying to get into this space, I'm told, so 
 
> good luck to them. I dont think TCS is though :-)) How many software 
 
> products come out of Indian cos? IFlex is the only company to have a 
 
> product successful worldwide. Making products is expensive and again, 
 
> there is no guarantee of success - why risk it when services give me 
 
> an assured income?
 
>
 
> Why do we need to get into high end IT - consulting and products?
 
> Simply because the algorithm of low cost, low margin services will run
 
> it's course in the future. As payscales rise in india and the rupee 
 
> appreciating wrt the dollar, margins become more and more slim. In 
 
> time, India may not be as competitive as say Brasil or Russia - the 
 
> American cos will take their projects out there! U can see trends in 
 
> the manufacturing sector - earlier Taiwan was the manufacturing base 
 
> for American cos, then SouthKorea and then these days, China. Indian 
 
> companies thus have 2 coices - identify and set shop in countries 
 
> where the low cost, low margin algorithm can be applied (TCS seems to 
 
> be taking this route) or enter into high end IT, which is independent 
 
> of geography (Which Infy is trying). I believe the latter is the 
 
> better route - it is a high margin business and reasonably high tech. 
 
> What is even better, is coming up with technology - like Java, 
 
> efficient databases, advanced operating systems (Like Sun, Oracle or
 
Microsoft).
 
> That
 
> is real tech. It's not that we can't do it. It's just that we dont
 
> want to risk it. But, nothing venture, nothing have! Desi companies 
 
> dont even do proper R&D!
 
>
 
> For too long have we been stuck in the procedure oriented IT services.
 
> It is time to invest in consulting and products, and take Indian IT to
 
> the next level, or else I fear we will remain stuck in this low end 
 
> nonsense.
 
>
 
> Finally, a true story. Taiwan Semiconductor Manufacturing Corporation
 
> (TSMC)
 
> was huge in the chip manufacturing industry, making almost 60% profit.
 
> They could have got into chip design, and potentially, designed low 
 
> cost chips. However, design is a risky business - what if the chip 
 
> bombs? TSMC chose to stick to it's core competence - fabrication. In 
 
> time, TSMC's profits have declined to 20% or so... they're still 
 
> number one, but dont make as much money as they used to... Are we 
 
> learning yet?
 
> PS: Work at TCS drove me so crazy; I quit to do a PhD :-) (Its not
 
> only TCS, the same applies to each and every IT company in India)
 
 

[ September 16, 2005: Message edited by: rathi ji ]

[Arjunkumar Shastry]

Its true.But wrong in Indian shops who are doing the job?Companies anywhere will do the job whatever situation demands.If TCS gets work in design of RTOS,they will hire the people whereever they are in the world.

[Sameer Jamal]

This reminds me of a an article "Silicon Valley or Coolie Valley" written by CEO of one Bangalore based firm

Its not > only TCS, the same applies to each and every IT company in India)

I think this guy is describing the situation as what I say is projection, "If I am bad then whole world is bad" this is not the case with every IT company in India, making assumption on whole IT Industry of India on the basis of experience of a single individual dosent seems to be convincing.

[Anand Prabhu]

It depends on the context of the person. A restless engineer wanting to move up the ladder will think like the person writing the letter. But, very few suggest an alternative solution. How does India provide employment to the scores of her educated populace? Turn back the tape to pre-liberalization era. It was such a frustrating era. Only the brightest and luckiest engineers got decent jobs at whatever private/public sector companies that existed. And if one had a BSc/BA/BComm degree, one was staring at a bleak future. Whatever one says, the current situation has given employment opportunities, financial power and confidence to a generation. How the IT companies move from here is a moot point.

[Sameer Jamal]

Good point Anand

[Ramesh Choudhary]

The article is worth it's weight in gold. I hardly have a year of experience, and I am starting to sneer at my job. Some times even a teaching job looks more interesting. But in a poor country, I should not complain for not getting an Innovative job. Even people from our so called 'elite' universities often do the above mentioned donkey work.

[Arjunkumar Shastry]

Many Indian companies do good work but you may not get coffee vending machines every 100 metres and may not get Thai/Chinese food in cafeteria.Do you want to work in such nondescript company?

[Sameer Jamal]

Situation is like glass halfway filled whether you see it as "Half-filled(optimism)" or you see it as "Half-Empty(pessimism)"

[Vladas Razas]

The guy who wrote this has "Straight Shooter to Upper Management" written all over him (c) Office Space. It's very interesting reading. I am not from India. These things are happening everywhere. I am almost afraid of word "outsourcing".

[Ram kovis]

Not sure, why people talk about TCS in negative way
BUt, what I see and what I hear from TCS friends

1) TCS is the one, who started Onsite-offshore model, which is being is followed by everybody..
2) 50% of their employees are at onsite.. and almost all the poeple get a chnace to travel.. And its not just for 6 months or 1 year.. many people stay -for example in US -for more than 6 years continuiusly.. One of my friends- he was in UK 2 years, Swiss for 1 yr,then US for 3 yrs, and now he is Australia for the last 1 year. Overall, he worked only 9 months in Offshore.. And all these years- he had 1month vacation every year, everythng by TCS. who will get it ?
3) TCS takes anyone into their organization, whether he is from CIVIL Engg or Coupters .. With basic common sense, anyone can work in JAVA etc.. we are not writing the code for NASA or hi-fi Google search alogirthms..
4) And nothing wrong working in Support projects.. Aprt from the work, you get a chance to improve communication skills as you interact with end users as well as tech leads, architects, while working on a problems.. Its defintely good learning experience. Its not just stop and start the server.. And with support projects, there is a guarantee money for organizations.. As long as comapny exists, the supoprt team is required.. no matter how stable appclitons are.. And I think, TCS is really good at this.. It involes a lot of things- support infrastructure, good resources, onsite-offshore resource management,

[Siddhartha Sharma]

2) 50% of their(TCS) employees are at onsite..

Please check up your facts..

One of my friends- he was in UK 2 years, Swiss for 1 yr,then US for 3 yrs, and now he is Australia for the last 1 year. Overall, he worked only 9 months in Offshore.. And all these years- he had 1month vacation every year, everythng by TCS. who will get it ?

the situation today is changed ..you are talking about ppl who joined beefore 2001 and stuff and in any case its an exception


4) And nothing wrong working in Support projects.. Aprt from the work, you get a chance to improve communication skills as you interact with end users as well as tech leads, architects, while working on a problems.. Its defintely good learning experience. Its not just stop and start the server.. And with support projects, there is a guarantee money for organizations.. As long as comapny exists, the supoprt team is required.. no matter how stable appclitons are.. And I think, TCS is really good at this.. It involes a lot of things- support infrastructure, good resources, onsite-offshore resource management,

Nothing wrong..but you dont move up the value chain with support projects...ya company profitablity increase..employee satisafaction decrease..attrition increase..

[David O'Meara]

"Siddhartha",
Please see the warning regarding your display name here.

Please note that we require a first name and last name and fictitious names are not allowed. Also, accounts with invalid display names get deleted.

thanks,
Dave.

[Siddhartha Sharma]

Originally posted by David O'Meara:
"Siddhartha",
Please see the warning regarding your display name here.

Please note that we require a first name and last name and fictitious names are not allowed. Also, accounts with invalid display names get deleted.

thanks,
Dave.

Don't have a Second name or a last name ..not even in my Official docs..I have only one name and that is my first name "Siddhartha"

[David O'Meara]

Quoted from the Naming Rules (link)

I understand that in some cultures there is no such thing as "first name and last name" - there is just one name. If you are one of these people, I would like to humbly ask you to sacrifice a piece of your culture to help me build this culture. In the past, permitting single names has inspired less wholesome "creative" aliases. The job of keeping names professional grew exponentially. The result is that exceptions to the naming rule are no longer permitted.

We do still require you to comply with the display name rule. Please consider alternatives that will be acceptable, otherwise your account will still be closed. I'll bring this up with the other moderators, but we have encountered this situation before and unfortunately we believe in enforcing the name rule strictly.

thanks,
David O'Meara.
[ September 19, 2005: Message edited by: David O'Meara ]

[Ram kovis]

Originally posted by Siddhartha:
[QB]2) 50% of their(TCS) employees are at onsite..

Please check up your facts..
OK. It may not be 50%. my friend forwarded these numbers..
TCS - India--> 18015
TCS - America--> 8354
TCS - United Kingdom--> 1884
TCS - Europe--> 923
TCS - Asia Pacific--> 706
TCS - IberoAmerica--> 261
TCS - South Africa--> 83
TCS - Middle East--> 82


Gross Total--> 30308

So , around 40% are at onsite.. I think, its still a big number..

the situation today is changed ..you are talking about ppl who joined beefore 2001 and stuff and in any case its an exception

May be, its because of Visa problems, especeially USA.. Why , are you not getting any?

/QB]