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Help to advocate java over .net  RSS feed

 
ataraxia
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Hi all,
I'm in an interesting situation: I've been writing ASP for a company who produces very large community-based sites for the entertainment industry. As a result of the growing userbase/site traffic and balooning requests for powerful apps from our clients, we've come to the realization that ASP is not cutting the mustard. The owner of the company is open to either Java/JSP or VB/.net. Either way, the move will be one into uncharted waters for the company as well as for myself, the primary developer. I've taken a java course and have been experimenting with java at home, and for personal reasons, I would VERY VERY VERY much rather rewrite the whole system with java/jsp than delve even deeper into a microsoft-centric platform.
I gave the owner of the company an argument as to why I thought java would be a better solution. But since I'm new to the language I feel that I was not able to provide much technical insight as to why java would unquestionably be the best.
Can someone help me out here, give me some advocacy help please. The (more obvious) reasons I gave were
there are more technical resources on the net for java
java is free
jsp is tried and true, .net is new and not tested
platform independence
working with XML appears as easy with Java as it is with ASP
anyone want to add, or provide links where I can get a more indepth understanding of creating rapid-app development system with Java/JSP/SQL/XML as opposed to .net? this is a good opportunity for me personally but I really want to make it work for my company too.
thanks a lot
ataraxia
 
Tony Alicea
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When do you need to deploy? Tomorrow? (Java option) or in a few years? (.NET?)
You do the java.lang.Math
 
Tony Alicea
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BTW (That's "By The Way...") Welcome to JavaRanch.Com but please read our username policy at http://www.javaranch.com/ubb/Forum10/HTML/000180.html and re-register at your earliest convenience!
Saludos,
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Sheriff Tony
 
scottie zman
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OK sorry for not reading instructions, here I am with a new username
 
Tony Alicea
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Thank You.
 
Carl Trusiak
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I think the largest aruement against .net is the fact that it has to run on a Windows server.
News anouncement this morning - 'Code Red 2 afflicted and crippled over 1000 Microsoft Servers yesterday....'
 
Tim Holloway
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In every organization you're going to run into people who with a big smirk on their face will tell you that Microsoft can do no wrong, and that it's the only way to go (or that Microsoft is the 800-lb. gorilla and that the smart way to go is whatever way they want you to go today). The older version of this was "Nobody ever got fired for buying IBM". These days, of course, they can.
Against these people - who all too often are the ones in the upper management levels - you'll also find a small, stridently vocal Anything-BUT-Microsoft crowd. You need to get both theses groups out of the room if you want to make an intelligent business decision.
There are two main issues, I think - one technical, one not. Technically speaking, the problem of .NET is that what it really means at the moment is ".Not yET". Microsoft is attempting to cure 20 years worth of Internet problems with a nice neat little (Microsoft) solution. Er, maybe I should strike the word "little". So far, they're running into the problem of having to at least consider the anti-trust aspects of what they're up against. Additionally, C# seems to be a sort of "black hole". We all know that ultimately 90% of C# is just a Java that isn't Java. If Microsoft could have successfully hijacked Java, C# wouldn't even exist - we'd be dealing with J++.
The black hole metaphor is more than just convenient - C# has proven to have its own gravitation - warping Visual Basic and the other MS languages into orbit around it. OK, fine. But one of the big reasons for GOING Microsoft is a large installed code base. If the code base becomes unusual, that reason dies. I could expand at length, but what it all boils down to is that .NET is going to involve some major turmoil, and we don't yet know all the ways it will impact us.
The other aspect is political. In one of life's little ironies, it seems that the antithesis to a centrally-planned communistic economy is a centrally-planned capitalistic monopoly. Central planning has a major problem. It only has a limited number of eyes to see and minds to think. Sooner or later this always seems to result in blind spots and missed ideas. I DON'T think that Bill Gates &Co. are an "evil empire". I also, however, don't think that they're the only and best source of all the solutions to all our problems, and for this reason, I'm reluctant to hand over control to them. I'd feel the same way about Sun and Java, should they ever reach that level of influence.
I've spent most my space on Microsoft. They ARE an 800-lb. gorilla, no doubt about it. However, most of us have up to now seen them as an 800-lb. gorilla in a Santa Claus suit. If you had to buy separately all the once-third-party utilities now bundled with Windows, a PC might well cost more than an automobile. On the other hand, their recent antics regarding Java show that there IS an 800-lb gorilla in that Santa suit, and it can take away as well as give. It's not so big a step from Microsoft's attempting to run Sun's business to having it attempt to run your own - and I don't just mean technically - Microsoft has played around in everything from cable TV to home mortgages.
So, in short, I'm in favor of Java. It works (NOW, not in future), it's no worse than any other solution out there, and it's a little bit of leverage to keep Santa honest.
 
Sunetra Saha
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That was a brilliant bit of level-headedness Tim, keep it up.
 
Vinay Kr
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Typically, the Microsoft platform is selected for productivity-oriented,moderately demanding projects and the J2EE platform
is selected for larger-scale systematic enterprise projects.
Ed Roman's article on j2ee vs .net prepared for Sun is at http://www.theserverside.com/resources/article.jsp?l=J2EE-vs-DOTNET .
Platform independence vs language independence ? at http://www.sdmagazine.com/ & http://www.sdmagazine.com/articles/2001/0103/0103a/0103af1.gif
Br.,
 
scottie zman
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From a purely selfish perspective, it seems to me that working with Java could result in a richer set of opportunities as well as a more lucrative programming career. As soon as I started getting my head around Java, I realized that if I could do everything in Java that I can currently do w/ASP, my potential as a programmer would be far greater because of the power of the language itself.
but that's off the topic...
Thanks for the thoughtful replies and the links!
 
It is sorta covered in the JavaRanch Style Guide.
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