How to ?

[Anonymous]

Hi,
I thinked twice - thrice before writing this thread.Hope u will not make fun.
I'm an indian guy staying in abroad.A few days back i met a japanese girl in laundry room of my big complex,luckly we started talking,and at the end i called for a dinner,she said yes,when i asked her contact number,she said,u can stick a message (written in paper)outside her appartment door,i said yes(!).
After two days i sticked a message in her appt door,inviting her for a dinner at Pizza hut,i wrote my my contact number in it and asked her to call me to confirm her arrival.I also left the same message in her post box.
But since two days she neither called me nor left any message.This making me sick now.I'm sure she read the message.( i left the message on monday and the dinner date is wednesday).
What i want to know is,1.is she trying to avoid me ?
2.Shall i go directly to her home and invite her for dinner so that i can get her friendship and also know what the truth is.
I'm really trying to get her friendship,since i don't have any friends here,i'm feeling alone and odd.
Please give me some suggestions on this.At present i'm looking like this
Regards
(Not ready to reveal my name)

[Jason Menard]

Do some research on what the typical Japanese dating ritual is. Different cultures do things differently. I do know that Japanese are generally very polite people (so it would be tough for her to refuse your initial invitation), so you can probably take her avoiding you as confirmation that she doesn't want to go out with you (sorry). You sure don't want to give her the impression you are stalking her. Going to her house and asking her directly, given that she already told you how to make contact, would probably place her in a situation she doesn't want to be in.
My recommendation. Find out where in your area other Indians or non-Japanese hang out. They have probably been in the same situation and can maybe offer some practical advice. If nothing else you will find others to hang out with.
My impression of the Japanese when I lived there was that they were polite and outwardly friendly for the most part, but they also could be a bit xenophobic. Signs written in English on the windows of some establishments that said "No Gaijin", as well as proprieters turning you away (you know, crossing the arms in an 'X' in front of them) when you entered an establishment kind of gave me that impression at least.
[ September 04, 2002: Message edited by: Jason Menard ]

[Anonymous]

Originally posted by Jason Menard:
Do some research on what the typical Japanese dating ritual is. Different cultures do things differently. I do know that Japanese are generally very polite people (so it would be tough for her to refuse your initial invitation), so you can probably take her avoiding you as confirmation that she doesn't want to go out with you (sorry). You sure don't want to give her the impression you are stalking her. Going to her house and asking her directly, given that she already told you how to make contact, would probably place her in a situation she doesn't want to be in.

Thanks a lot for your reply.
But what confusing me more is. when i called her for dinner,She said" Yeah that would be nice,Sure i will,i also like to taste ur indian foods as well..." All the moment she talked very nice and friendly with me.
Regd ur recommendation: Its difficult,none of people here in my complex is indians.But will sure try to pick someone to know more abt her and escp japanese dating culture.
Thanks again Jason.
Regards.

[Anthony Villanueva]

Try to be friends with her first. Japanese women are usually conservative, and a informal dinner date for two (even in Pizza hut) with a stranger they've just met would be... unseemly.
Light and friendly banter, courtly behavior, and excellent listening skills are your allies.

[Jason Menard]

Its difficult,none of people here in my complex is indians.
They let you out of the complex occasionally, don't they?

But what confusing me more is. when i called her for dinner,She said" Yeah that would be nice,Sure i will,i also like to taste ur indian foods as well..." All the moment she talked very nice and friendly with me.
Yes, she is female (I'm assuming). They've been known to pull this one. It's probably in their genes so they can't help it.
Hell if I had a dime for every time a woman I asked out said to me "Sure thing!" and then avoided me, or every time a woman said to me "Get away from my window you freak!", or "Stop following me or I'll call the cops and get a restraining order!", or "If you don't leave me alone I'll have my father/brother/husband kick your ass!", or "Please stop, you're scaring the children!", or that old favorite "Don't come in here, I've got a gun!", well surely I'd almost be able to make a one-minute long distance phone-call or something with all those dimes.
[ September 04, 2002: Message edited by: Jason Menard ]

[Anthony Villanueva]

Originally posted by Jason Menard:
Yes, she is female (I'm assuming). They've been known to pull this one. It's probably in their genes so they can't help it.

When women say no they mean no. But sometimes when they say yes, they also mean no. It is a very confusing protocol...

[Anonymous]

Jason & Anthony!...Its seems u got good experience on this.
Yes u r right,no indians within my complex is also an added advantage .
Girls were acting smart than guys.
I believe i still got time and chance.I will try to meet her while she waiting in bus stop or while crossing my complex base or again in laundry,during that momemts if she says "don't disturb me.good bye",then i really can't tolerate that,it will hurt my heart and mind,bcos i was broughtup like that.thats the reason i'm staying behind than taking any step.
Sure one day i will make it.
Regards.

[Anthony Villanueva]

Originally posted by <Ranch hand>:
Jason & Anthony!...Its seems u got good experience on this.

Me? Good experience with women?
hahahahahahahahahaha
Okay, when you go dating, you just have to be a bit tough-skinned. It's just like posting on MD. Be sincere and up front. If you get rejected, don't sulk or flame up. Be gracious till the end, and withdraw with dignity. If you think you can't handle that, my friend, well...
[ September 04, 2002: Message edited by: Anthony Villanueva ]

[Mark Fletcher]

Pizza Hut?!??!
Man, that is soooo classy. Really.
Show her you care. Treat her to a taco bell and a four pack of Sam Adams.
Mark

[Anthony Villanueva]

:runs away with tail between legs:

[Mapraputa Is]

What? Nobody has good experience with women? All this thread is scaring. How do geeks propagate?
This may be a risky advice, but next time you can try this: tell her "you know, I just need friends, please, do not think it's a date"etc. Now she will think "He isn't interested in me as a women???"
Now it's her job to get you interested

[Jason Menard]

Originally posted by <Ranch hand>:
Jason & Anthony!...Its seems u got good experience on this.

Ever see that movie with Mel Gibson, What Women Want? You know he could hear women's thoughts and knew exactly what they wanted. I'm kinda just the opposite. I seem to have this incredible knack of knowing exactly "What Women Don't Want". :roll:
To be fair to our anonymous friend, taking someone to Pizza Hut in Japan is not quite as bad as taking someone to Pizza Hut in the states. It's close, but not quite as bad.
Of course the more I think about it... Pizza Hut?!? What were you thinking man. Better would have been for you to invite over your place and cook her something from home. Since you are both in the same complex, that leaves her within her "safe" zone and would probably make her feel a bit more comfortable, particularly since she would be free to leave whenever she wanted.
Of course if you wanted to get out of this situation, you could always apologize to her that things didn't work out as far as dinner goes, but since she said she wouldn't mind trying some Indian food, bring her a plate and tell her you had leftovers and thought she might like some. Tell her you hope she enjoys it and then just leave. If nothing else, at some point she should return your dishes. Maybe she'll return the favor.
Things will probably go smoother if you drop the dating idea from your mind for the time being, imho. Think casual, "neighborly" relationship for the time being.
[ September 04, 2002: Message edited by: Jason Menard ]

[Anthony Villanueva]

And never ever discuss politics or religion...

[Rufus BugleWeed]

Hey kids, your supposed to meet in a public place each arriving by your own modes of transport. Try this the first few times.
That makes each feel safer and more independent.
Surely your apartment complex is going to have social gatherings. You will see her in the laundry again.
Maybe she had to leave town for a few days, is sick, or very busy with final exams.
It's not sexual harassment until she says no.
I thought you Indian guys just went back to India the parents fix you up and you come back with the wife.
Indian friend of mine had this arrangement.
He got laid off or put on bench for a month.
Would you believe nine months later two became three.
Don't be hesitant to try the personals in your city either.
Heck, if you list your city name folks at the JR might help you out.
In my city, I know where Little Bombay is. We not changing the name to Mumbia, either. I know where it is in Chicago too.
If you live in any city of good size there's going to be international food stores.

[Rufus BugleWeed]

Oh, I forgot Samprakesh's trick.
Every Sunday he went somewhere he called The Temple. He liked to do yard work there for the exercise. What he really liked about The Temple was there was terrific Indian food there, free. He did not have to cook it and always plenty of Hindus to dine with.
[ September 04, 2002: Message edited by: Rufus Bugleweed ]

[Nanhesru Ningyake]

Hi desi ranchhand, what country are you in? You can always look at websites like match.com, indianmatches.com, shaadi.com, bharatmatrimony.com.
Consider visiting your local library more often. There's a good chance of making friends there. There are usually some lectures, or classes held through out the year - see if something interests you, and sign up - you might meet someone really nice, and with similar interests too.
Hang out at your local temple - while it can be rewarding in intangible ways, you might also meet other Indians like you, even girls.
Find out if there's a local Indian or your native language association. Become a member and offer to volunteer - that's a sure way to make friends (and get great food too!).
You will make friends - that'll happen eventually. But just don't get carried away in your friendship - because a girl can be sensitive, and clinging - forming deep attachments, and you don't want to break her heart by announcing out of the blue that your parents have found a girl for you, and that you're getting married in a month.

[David Weitzman]

I can't sit quietly while people insult the class of Pizza Hut -- that is, Pizza Hut's with buffets. The sweet desert pizzas, the warm cinnamin breadsticks... Mmmmm. And of course the filling, crunchy-crusted regular pizza if you're into that sort of thing.

[Anonymous]

Originally posted by Mark Fletcher:

Show her you care. Treat her to a taco bell and a four pack of Sam Adams.
Mark

ROFL
Awesome!

[Mark Fletcher]

Originally posted by David Weitzman:
I can't sit quietly while people insult the class of Pizza Hut -- that is, Pizza Hut's with buffets. The sweet desert pizzas, the warm cinnamin breadsticks... Mmmmm. And of course the filling, crunchy-crusted regular pizza if you're into that sort of thing.

Im sorry . To be honest, for me Pepperoni and cheese with *extra cheese* stuffed crust pizza from Pizza Hut is simply the equivalent of crack cocaine for me, its just that if I suggested to my girlfriend that we have a romantic night out at Pizza Hut, she'd kick my ass up and down the street!
But best of luck to Anonymous and his Japanese friend... I felt my previous mail came off a bit harsh.
Mark

[ September 05, 2002: Message edited by: Mark Fletcher ]

[Anonymous]

{
He did not have to cook it and always plenty of Hindus to dine with.
}
Thats right,Even we used to employ that trick on Sundays when I was in US.
Hint for Hungries:In Sikh temple called as Gurudwara ,daily lunch/dinner are served free.This is true for most of the Gurudwaras.You must cover your head with cloth, and put the shoes off before entering the place.

[Paavam Payyan]

I am afraid, suggestions asking Mr. HelpWanted to visit Indian hangouts may not help him to find his love-at-laundry Japanese girl.
I would suggest him to identify a couple of places where that girl normally hang out, and frequently visit there (like a couple of times every hour ). If you pick the right spot and the right time and make yourself available there with a innocent ?Peter Parker? appearance, you will accidentally (!) meet her again in one of these places, and say, "Hi, its you again! Wow Cool! Hey, I guess you were really busy the other day when we had that dinner plan around, right? Never mind, me too! "
Then its up to you! Goodluck!

[Paavam Payyan]

Another must-do suggestion is to stick another note (again name+number) at her door, but this time make sure no one else gets it (like your *friends*, or that tall dude next door, who don't like you playing music too loud).
Even better slip into her mailbox, but hey watch out for Japanese burglar alarms. They are pretty loud!

[Anthony Villanueva]

Originally posted by Nanhesru Ningyake:
But just don't get carried away in your friendship - because a girl can be sensitive, and clinging - forming deep attachments, and you don't want to break her heart by announcing out of the blue that your parents have found a girl for you, and that you're getting married in a month.

I didn't believe this at first until I confirmed it with an Indian friend:
A: is it true that INdian families still make arranged marriages...?
A: I was reading this forum thread in Javaranch you see...
C: Yes its true
A: oh. I thought he hwas just kidding...
C: no
A: really?
C: Normally poeple go for arranged marraiges
C: very less people go for love marraiges
A: I see. So if a boy/girl marries someone for love against the family's wishes that's bad, yes?
C: Yes
C: kind of
C: very lessa families approve it
A: curious. so, you can date your wife-to-be?
C: I did not get you
C: There is no concept of dating in indian culture
A: On second thought the whole thing seems prety sensible. Why go through the hassle of dating when your family can recommend an acceptable spouse...
C: It is
C: there are disadvantages here also
C: you will not know anything about the person before marrying
C: its a very big gamble
A: oh, you don't get to see the person...?
C: These days you girl and guy meet
C: but it not be a dating level kind of
A: I see... because a family member is always around to keep tabs, I suppose
C: Not all the time though
C: some parents are good
C: and some are very strict
C: it depends
A: ah, so the pair can sneak out for some fun
C: Its luck basically
C: it does not happen that fast
C: people in india are not that fast, atleast people who go for arranged marraige
A: well, I meant harmless fun
C: Okay
C: what ever

[Jamie Robertson]

Why is everyone forcing this guy to find Indian people, hang out in Indian places, and generally suggest that he 'be with his own nationals'??? whatever they call it in your town! I agree you should get off your couch and venture out a little further than your laundry room though! If you like Japanese/Women from the Far East, start hanging out in Chinatown, little china or Japanland!!
I can't believe she said "Yeah that would be nice,Sure i will,i also like to taste ur indian foods as well..." and you responded with "Well how about Pizza Hut!" Dude, she said she'd like to try Indian food!! What you should do, is the next time you see her ( and make yourself conveniently available in the laundry room and lobby ), say that you remembered that she would like to try traditional indian food, and ask her if she'd like to try it at your apartment or at an excellent indian restaurant you know of. ( If you don't know of one, start doing some research! ). If she seems a little apprehensive ask her if she would feel more comfortable bringing a friend. Not only will it make her feel more comfortable about your intentions, but you'll double your chances!!
But beware, once you go Japanese, you never go back ( It happened to me, married her in the end ) !
Jamie
[ September 05, 2002: Message edited by: Jamie Robertson ]

[Jason Menard]

Originally posted by Paavam Payyan:
I would suggest him to identify a couple of places where that girl normally hang out, and frequently visit there (like a couple of times every hour ). If you pick the right spot and the right time and make yourself available there with a innocent ?Peter Parker? appearance, you will accidentally (!) meet her again in one of these places, and say, "Hi, its you again! Wow Cool! Hey, I guess you were really busy the other day when we had that dinner plan around, right? Never mind, me too! "

So you are saying that stalking is the way to go then. Because basically, if this happens often enough, the girl is going to get weirded out by the frequency of these "coincidental" meetings. Kind of creepy and desparate if you ask me. Then there are the rest of the tenants who might be concerned when you set up residency in the laundry room.
Seriously if you "accidentally" bump into her one or two more times, no problem... If not, probably time to hang out in someone else's laundry room.
[ September 05, 2002: Message edited by: Jason Menard ]

[Younes Essouabni]

For once I agree with Jason (once won't hurt ), as she seems to like indian food, bring some Indian food to her.
Inviting her for the first date to your apartment, isn't it a little too harsh??
Food is the Key, forget about the Pizza! Can't believe you said Pizza-hut
What's so bad with arranged mariages?
Is there Gurudwara in Europe??

[Anthony Villanueva]

Originally posted by Younes Essouabni:
What's so bad with arranged mariages?

Never said I disapproved. Never said I totally agree either.

[Janet Wilson]

Alright guys...don't ask me why in the world I even looked at this section (ok, yes, I was getting a little bored, so what the heck) and then to respond but being one of those "female types" I figured I'd add my 2 cents to this pot in no particular order...
1. Do NOT stalk her - that will absolutely end all hopes!
2. Do NOT seem desparate - i.e.-don't hang out at the laundromat in hopes that you can correct yourself (I agree with Jamie) by offering Pizza Hut when she wanted to try Indian Food. If you bump into her again, great - if not, oh well.
3. "Games" (yes means no and no means yes and other junk) are played by members of both sexes! It's sad, but true. Happens in corporate world and the dating world. Sometimes you run into people who are candid and trustworthy. Have I been around the block at all?
4. You may have a cultural thing going on here, when she said she would like to go out but has rebuffed your advances but I think it may be more like the situation of people having a hard time saying no in front of another person. It's easier to say you will go out some other time than to say she has no interest. If she hasn't followed up with you, then I would take the hint that she doesn't have an interest.
5. Indian, Japanese, German, American - who cares? You want to find someone with a good heart and who is honest - forget about the "outer wrapping"!
6. Arranged Marriages - YUCK! Can you tell that I'm an American woman - originally from New York City of all places? It sounds terrible! It should be destiny which makes the matches work, not a pre-arranged deal.
7. Pizza Hut is ok but it's not New York City pizza! At least with Pizza Hut, you know you'll get it made pretty much the same way whether you are in Europe, Canada, US, etc.
Lastly, good luck finding your "love". Things that are meant to be will be....que sera sera.
Janet

[Paavam Payyan]

Yeah people, Arranged marriage sucks, I agree. But fact is that I never thought its bad when I was there. (I am from South-West India, living in Ireland at the moment).
Arranged marriages was looking perfectly fine to me when I was in India. Arranged marriages was taking place every now and then, and it was fun, couples were always (99.99%) happy with each other. Its just fact that arranged marriages tend to last longer than love marriages, in India.
Well, trying to understand why arranged marriages works in Indian culture, but no where else (well, almost), I came to a conclusion that it could be because of the social commitment bride and groom makes, because after all its not them, but the whole community decides this and they are responsible to live up to their expectations. Also they will have to face the same society if they were about to think of a second marriage, which is not a popular idea there.
But now I feel, its not that simple. This could be because of the different styles of upbringing or what ever, a person has more individuality in the west, compared to Indians. This is a generalisation, there could be people with lesser individuality in west and some with higher in India - 'just exceptions'!. When an average Indian is about to take a decision, mostly he will stick to what every one else from equivalent background has been doing.
I think this 'less individual - more society' type mentality is playing a big part in the success of arranged marriages. Because when a marriage is being 'arranged', it works out in such a fashion that both bride and groom have similar backgrounds and interests. With a 'not-so-particular' individuality, its easier for both of them to cope with each other, and they stay together for rest of the life.
Oops, my phone... I guess its my mom calling from India, asking me to tell her about my marriage plans. She can't wait to arrange it!! No ma, listen to me please... No, let me... uhh� !!

[Anonymous]

Correct.In the last 20 years country has changed quite a lot.Still as one Booker Prize winner said "India lives in many centuries at the same time" is correct.Although Technology has changed the lives of many,mentality almost remains same.Thats why you could see in the matrimonial in Newspaper as "Boy age-28,Harvard MBA working in Boston seeks girl from well settled family from XYZ caste.Girl should fair,be between 23-26 ,graduate in Science/Engg.Please contact alphaBeta etc."

[Shubhrajit Chatterjee]

Marriage is good. Arranged Marriage is also good. Love Marriage is also good. Living together is better

[Jason Menard]

Originally posted by Shubhrajit Chatterjee:
Marriage is good. Arranged Marriage is also good. Love Marriage is also good. Living together is better.

Hmmm.... I take it you've never been married. :roll:

[sim sim]

Originally posted by Jason Menard:

Hmmm.... I take it you've never been married. :roll:

LOL Jason, this is the best msg u have posted

[Shubhrajit Chatterjee]

[b]Right !!! {/b]

Originally posted by Jason Menard:

Hmmm.... I take it you've never been married. :roll:

[Anonymous]

First, find yourself a job where you need to work from 12 noon to 1 am in the morning. Such job are likely to be food seller. Then after you come back from your work at 1 am, have a nice shower and watch the DVD or VCD, then call her or go slip a note at this time. Try these for 6 months, if you can't get her, a man got to do what a man got to do. You need a larger sample size for a 95% hypothesis poisson distribution or normal distribution.

[Anonymous]

To have a large sample size is important as in any case if your number 1 turn fat, you can label her your number 2 and exalt your number 2 to number 1.

[Anonymous]

Johnson, you are truly an invaluable asset to the ranch :roll:

[Johnson Chong]

Wait, I got a better idea! Send her an audio casette with the song "Making Love out of Nothing at all" & ask her to pay attention to the lyrics. Or another song with the lyrics that goes 'I know I'm not the man you're missing, that's why you go away I know'
Or just tell her that you can look into her future and she wouldn't be able to get someone much better than you.

[Anonymous]

Operation Success!.. Mission completed.
Took her to an indian restra for a dinner.
Now she is my good friend.
Thanks to everyone who gave me tips.

[Paul Stevens]

Thanks for the update.