For Indian Citizens only

[Anonymous]

http://santabanta.com/newsmaker.asp?catname=Interesting%20Read&select=798
http://santabanta.com/newsmaker.asp?catname=Interesting%20Read&select=797

[R K Singh]

good one

[Pradeep bhatt]

[Devesh H Rao]

Take a bow Mr President.

[Sara Jahan]

This man always makes me feel very hopeful and positive about things. I feel there is some hope...

[Arjun Shastry]

Originally posted by Sara Jahan:
This man always makes me feel very hopeful and positive about things. I feel there is some hope...

True but unless he attacks and cleans up corrupt political chimps and beurocrats,arm chaired scientists flourishing on public money,its fruitless to request 10 minutes from somebody.Its the ruling and ecomonically stronger class to which Kalam should give advice and make them straight then advice common man.
[ July 06, 2003: Message edited by: Capablanca Kepler ]

[John Dunn]

The article was interesting. What religious backround is he? What about ethnicity and 'caste' or is that 100% totally irrelevant?

[R K Singh]

Originally posted by John Dunn:
The article was interesting. What religious backround is he? What about ethnicity and 'caste' or is that 100% totally irrelevant?

Its only relevant to less than 10% people.
Even its not there fault, they are toys of politicians' hand, fully brain-washed.

[Devesh H Rao]

Originally posted by John Dunn:
The article was interesting. What religious backround is he? What about ethnicity and 'caste' or is that 100% totally irrelevant?

He is an Indian and i hope he stays just that.

[Sara Jahan]

Originally posted by John Dunn:
The article was interesting. What religious backround is he? What about ethnicity and 'caste' or is that 100% totally irrelevant?

His religious background or ethnicity or caste never comes in the pic. Before he became a President, he was a Scientist - a real successful one. He received the highest civilian award - Padma Vibhushan - in 1990. But in a parliamentary form of Govt (as in India), the President is only a titular or constitutional head, the real power lies with the Prime Minister. As a result, most of his predecessors have been ever-smiling, ribbon-cutting grandpas, who have had nothing much to do.
Dr Abdul Kalam however has given his office some character. He is not empowered by the Constitution to do much, but atleast he genuinely wants the best for his country and not just himself. When he speaks, people listen. With complete disillusionment with the current bunch of crooks masqurading as politicians, we do need somebody like him who we can atleast say "look at the brighter side of things."
/Sara

[John Dunn]

His religious background or ethnicity or caste never comes in the pic.
The reason I asked is I know that there is internal trouble in India, so I wondered how his background might affect how folks pay attention to him. AND GRANTED, I don't know anything about current Indian politics, so I am truly asking out of basic curiosity and just to get a sense of some of the general issues.
Imagine if you read Dr. Martin Luther King's 'I Have A Dream' speech and didn't know anything about American race/religion relations in the 60's. You could walk away with some very unrealistic expectations of MLK, right? That is why I asked...

[Matt Cao]

Hello,
I watched the program Taboo of National Geographics Today a week or more ago. One thing strike me as odd, the Indians on the show claimed India does not have caste system anymore, but replace it with community. The only way one escape his or her community is death.
This India President article is very moving, I would place him along with Gandhi. Unless he could tackle the core of the India problems, his speech is only just that.
Martin Luther King Jr paid for his vision with his life. The proven fact is US census trying to have a category dealing with multi-racials.
Regards,
MCao

[Devesh H Rao]

Originally posted by Capablanca Kepler:

True but unless he attacks and cleans up corrupt political chimps and beurocrats,arm chaired scientists flourishing on public money,its fruitless to request 10 minutes from somebody.Its the ruling and ecomonically stronger class to which Kalam should give advice and make them straight then advice common man.
[ July 06, 2003: Message edited by: Capablanca Kepler ]

Buddy ask urself what have u done urself to make india a strong country .....
Please visit this site and give ur 10 minutes
http://www.ipetitions.com/campaigns/SupremeCourtIndia_Clean_Politics/
Try to make a difference rather than waiting for others do it for u.
Thank u

[Derek Grey]

Great Article.
It is very true that we should start calling ourselves a "developed nation". The press and journalists are nothing but a pain in the neck and they should not be taken seriously. Every country has slums along with sky scrappers and we don't need the press to tell us that.
Only when we are proud of who we are will others give us respect. Hey isn't that why we give other countrymen respect?
I am proud that the President of my country is a well-balanced person who aims high and expects the same of his countrymen. To top that...he's a successful "Rocket Scientist" by profession.

[Madhav Lakkapragada]

Its only relevant to less than 10% people.
Even its not there fault, they are toys of politicians' hand, fully brain-washed.
............
He is an Indian and i hope he stays just that

I, personally think its far more than 10%, unfortunate but its a fact. If they are grown-ups, its completely their fault...give me a break a 40 year old man but we say its not his fault?
Also, I do not see anything wrong in practicing a religion. Its your choice, you do it. But don't ever forget that we are all humans first.
The biggest problem is the political system. If a few good people can eliminate the tons of corrupt politicians, India would have a different footing in the world. These are the people who sit in big offices and make unfortunate decisions...
One thing is that the powerful (by muscle or mouth or political) people rule.
My two cents......

[Devesh H Rao]

Originally posted by Madhav Lakkapragada:

Its only relevant to less than 10% people.
Even its not there fault, they are toys of politicians' hand, fully brain-washed.
............
He is an Indian and i hope he stays just that

I, personally think its far more than 10%, unfortunate but its a fact. If they are grown-ups, its completely their fault...give me a break a 40 year old man but we say its not his fault?
Also, I do not see anything wrong in practicing a religion. Its your choice, you do it. But don't ever forget that we are all humans first.
The biggest problem is the political system. If a few good people can eliminate the tons of corrupt politicians, India would have a different footing in the world. These are the people who sit in big offices and make unfortunate decisions...
One thing is that the powerful (by muscle or mouth or political) people rule.
My two cents......

Ur two cents here please......
http://www.ipetitions.com/campaigns/SupremeCourtIndia_Clean_Politics/

[R K Singh]

Originally posted by Madhav Lakkapragada:

Its only relevant to less than 10% people.
Even its not there fault, they are toys of politicians' hand, fully brain-washed.

In indian and as well in world all over there are waves ... But let us talk about India.
In 1990, wave was Bofors which ended up with Mandal and then Kamandal.
But Kamandal failed because any responsible person cant fit Kamandal because of International after affects and indian social physce.
When there is no wave then false waves would be created like recent Gujrat election.
Its pity that a common indian still allows himself to be taken for free ride by politicians.
But its really a difficult task to get good politicians.
I read it somewhere :
Politicians are worse than vultures as atleast they live on dead men.
One thing is that the powerful (by muscle or mouth or political) people rule.
My two cents......
Yes, history is witness, all the time only powerful people rule.
Whoever says that its not Jungle Raj in human society, he is lying to you.

[Devesh H Rao]

Originally posted by Ravish Kumar:
Originally posted by Madhav Lakkapragada:

Yes, history is witness, all the time only powerful people rule.
Whoever says that its not Jungle Raj in human society, he is lying to you.

yeah but it is in our hands whether to chose the power of intelluct or the power of muscle ..isn't it .

[Arjun Shastry]

Till how many years we will blame Indian politicians? Afterall we elect these bunch of leaders,Is't it?and in last 10-12 years (after T N Sheshan took over as CEC),almost all elections are fair and free.and they are the same people among us.In North we elect Mulayam Singh(who had once arrested for murder cases),Inthe West we elect Sharad Pawar who once gave the orders to police officers to treat bomb blast suspect genetly.Then in South we elect Jailalitha who is the queen of corruption. We can safely make conclusion that majority of we Indians want these leaders over years and years and hence majority of Indians do not want clean government andleaders.(History of elections will show that genuine and honest people have lost elections miserably,be it a state or national election).
Can we conclude that majority of Indians(keeping aside 30% illiterate population) are of not honest and genuine and hence elect these leaders over the years?
[ July 09, 2003: Message edited by: Capablanca Kepler ]

[Pradeep bhatt]

Why can't we remove corrupt politician out of power. We can do that.
The real problem is either we dont vote or select a wrong candidate. The fault lies in with the voters and not the politicians.
[ July 09, 2003: Message edited by: Pradeep Bhat ]

[Arjun Shastry]

Originally posted by Pradeep Bhat:
Why can't we remove corrupt politician out of power. We can do that.
The real problem is either we dont vote or select a wrong candidate. [ July 09, 2003: Message edited by: Pradeep Bhat ]

and voting doesn't happen blindly.The general opinion nowadays about politician is "(S)he does the work,so whats wrong if (s)he make some money?"
Majority of business class(including Business houses,medium sized shop owners,businessmen)were/are corrupt since British era.These were the same people who allowed exploitation of people and resources.To exploit further these people want politicians of this kind in power.Remember that these are not just handful of people but in hundreds of thousands.
[ July 09, 2003: Message edited by: Capablanca Kepler ]

[Devesh H Rao]

Originally posted by Capablanca Kepler:

and voting doesn't happen blindly.The general opinion nowadays about politician is "(S)he does the work,so whats wrong if (s)he make some money?"
[ July 09, 2003: Message edited by: Capablanca Kepler ]

The same chalta hai attitude which has been a hallmark of indians and is the root cause of the many ills in our society...
Look no body is telling to clean up everything at one go but a small begining has to be made somewhere .
each person can start contributing in a small way say like for example paying the fines at a traffic violation instead of bribing the traffic cop, or not trying to get a job thru a a reference letter . all this is tough no doubt and the person initiating this habits will have to pay a heavy price for standing by his principles (take tarun tejpal of tehelka for example) but somebody has to bell the cat so our thinking should be why somebody why not me....
and yes u are very correct when u say that the numbers is in thousands but this has to be checked before a day comes here we have to pay a price for breathing the air itself..!!!

[R K Singh]

Originally posted by Pradeep Bhat:
The fault lies in with the voters and not the politicians.

As I have told earlier. you have to chose bad out of worst.
I wont say that new kind of politicians are not coming up like Krishna (CM of Karnatka) or Naidu(CM of AP) then at the same time we have also Modi and Lallo.
Its a kind of deadlock between education and population.
More education less corrupt politicians[public would be more aware of their surrounding world] but then problem is of population, population is more because education is not proper. Education is not proper because population is more
In the recent years, Govt is spending money like anything on NGOs but IMO 70% NGO are enjoying red tape system and Govt. efforts are going in to vain.
Its not that all NGOs are just making money some are really doing good job but again number is less
Now who will break this deadlock ....
To break this deadlock, combine effort is needed, though it has been started and its great to see it work but still lot of more work & power is needed to be done by both Govt and coderanch.

[Arjun Shastry]

Originally posted by Ravish Kumar:

I wont say that new kind of politicians are not coming up like Krishna (CM of Karnatka) or Naidu(CM of AP) then at the same time we have also Modi and Lallo.

Did you ask anybody from Andhra Pradesh about Naidu? "He takes bribes in dollars but does the work efficiently!"thats the opinion I heard.

More education less corrupt politicians[public would be more aware of their surrounding world]

IMO, Education has nothing to do with corruption.Enron ex-CEO Rebecca Mark was Harvard MBA and Manohar Joshi who built mansions and hotels on that bribe(for clearing Enron power plant) was MA and was a teacher before entering politics!! .Did you read somebody from Enron said last year? "We spent almost some million dollars for educating Indian politicians about Enron"
[ July 09, 2003: Message edited by: Capablanca Kepler ]
[ July 09, 2003: Message edited by: Capablanca Kepler ]

[R K Singh]

Originally posted by Capablanca Kepler:

IMO, Education has nothing to do with corruption.

I am talking about voter's not politicians.
Politicians will remain same but voter will be more open to the world around and it will help them to choose bad one

[Pradeep bhatt]

I agree.. Corruption comes from greed.. and i feel educated guys are more greedy

:

IMO, Education has nothing to do with corruption

[ July 09, 2003: Message edited by: Pradeep Bhat ]

[Madhav Lakkapragada]

Divesh / Pradeep :
I appreciate your ideas. I had them once but not anymore, sorry.
If it helps, I will acknowledge I am guilty of
not voting, so be it.
While idealism and optimism are good, a touch of reality is always needed and I for one would like
to talk reality, rather than we can do it.
I have seen a lot of this talk and after so many years of not doing it maybe I am a pessimist. I believe its nothing more than a cliche like those Miss Universe/World participants....blah blah blah blah and WORLD PEACE.
Two more cents...........
- madhav

[Devesh H Rao]

Originally posted by Madhav Lakkapragada:
Divesh / Pradeep :
I appreciate your ideas. I had them once but not anymore, sorry.
If it helps, I will acknowledge I am guilty of
not voting, so be it.
While idealism and optimism are good, a touch of reality is always needed and I for one would like
to talk reality, rather than we can do it.
I have seen a lot of this talk and after so many years of not doing it maybe I am a pessimist. I believe its nothing more than a cliche like those Miss Universe/World participants....blah blah blah blah and WORLD PEACE.
Two more cents...........
- madhav

for me it has been the other way round. i started out with a "chalta hai how the hell does it concern me" attitude but then i think over a period i have got involved a little bit not much but still enuf to say i try to make a difference.
anways to each his own life
ya and one more thing too i despise our current lot of politicians so me haven't voted either .
so atleast have something in common there.

[R K Singh]

Originally posted by Devesh H Rao:
i despise our current lot of politicians so me haven't voted either .

Though I never voted for the same reason .. but now I feel that I have not utilized my power.
Who cares whether it makes difference or not but at least I practice my rights .. [if i dont vote then its for sure that its not going to make any difference.]
AW I believe in try and lose and again try ... so I will do it from this time ..

[Devesh H Rao]

Originally posted by Ravish Kumar:

AW I believe in try and lose and again try ... so I will do it from this time ..

Try Try till someone else suceeds ..!!!
give me somebody like Sarder patel, Lal bahadur shastri, Abdul Kalam or somebody even half decent as these people i will vote anyday yaar
but me not goin to waste my vote on half literate buffons struting out their stuff out in the election jungle.
Actually we should have another option
> None of the above
as in multiple choice q? along with the names of contestants in the voter list then maybe i will vote and i wont be surprised if this option actually wins hands down in many constituencies .
[ July 10, 2003: Message edited by: Devesh H Rao ]

[Madhav Lakkapragada]

AW I believe in try and lose and again try ... so I will do it from this time
Good luck.
I do believe in that too, only when I think I will be successfull eventually. But with the Indian politics, sorry!!!
give me ....
That's probably one of our (possibly including myself) problems. No one ever gives a damn. You want it, you must get it with your hardwork. PERIOD. Although, the reason I do not atttempt is that I KNOW its beyond my ability. Please, do not get me started on believe in yourself or take the first step.... Trust me when I say I know how Indian Government works!!!
Yet another two cents..........
- madhav

[R K Singh]

Originally posted by Madhav Lakkapragada:
Trust me when I say I know how Indian Government works!!!
- madhav

Me too.
Waiting for something to happend.. I am waiting.. I am waiting ..
I am happy, I have evrything .... and I want something to happen
OR
I know it wont happen.. I know it wont happen .. I know it wont happen.
He either already know everything in advance or wait for someone else to do....
Not you fault... basic problem of an Indian like Indian Govt.
my 2 cents.

[R K Singh]

Originally posted by Devesh H Rao:
Sarder patel, Lal bahadur shastri, Abdul Kalam

There footsteps are still here because no one else follows these footsteps.

[Devesh H Rao]

Originally posted by Madhav Lakkapragada:

My two cents......
Two more cents...........
Yet another two cents..........
- madhav

Originally posted by Ravish Kumar :

my 2 cents.

U ppl are rich ...

Originally posted by Ravish Kumar :

There footsteps are still here because no one else follows these footsteps.

ya man adolosence , hormones ... i will grow out of it

[Nanhesru Ningyake]

As the President says, we all complain about how bad the system is - what are you doing to change it? It's not just whether you vote, or whom you vote for. That's too passive.
Mahatma Gandhi said 'Be the change you want to see in the world.' How can we implement this? Are you willing to go help clean up the local pile of garbage at the end of your street? Extending this further, are you willing to give up your plush software job and work at the city government office, doing your part to keep the city clean? Have you considered joining a local action group campaigning, petitioning, and actually doing something good for the community?
What we need is to start or join a grassroots movement group (excuse the clich�), at any level. One such successful group I have been observing is the Bangalore Agenda Task Force. This isn't exactly a grassroots organization - it has been initiated by the Government of Karnataka, with active involvement and investment by the private sector - the software companies that have made Bangalore the tech hub of the country. Together, this group has been slowly transforming the city. (I want to volunteer for them - when I return to Bangalore.)
When these such groups start mushrooming all over the country - slowly we will see greater public awareness - and then we the public will elect the right leaders for us - and this will transform the whole nation.

[R K Singh]

Originally posted by Nanhesru Ningyake:
As the President says, we all complain about how bad the system is - what are you doing to change it?

First of all I am pessimist, secondly I want all things should be done by others. Why only I should do or care ?
No NO .. I dont make any difference .. and I wont do anything.
I am waiting for Messiah who will do things for me.

[Devesh H Rao]

Originally posted by Ravish Kumar:

No NO .. I dont make any difference .. and I wont do anything.
I am waiting for Messiah who will do things for me.

no ravish i am not goin to do anything for u ...

[R K Singh]

Originally posted by Devesh H Rao:

no ravish i am not goin to do anything for u ...

No, you have to do it.
Once you are done then I will enjoy the fruits but dont ask me now to do anything.

[Madhav Lakkapragada]

Nanhesru:
I respect your views.
Also, nice to hear that you will join the group in Bangalore, albeit when you return.
Before I make any comments....just curious, how long have you lived in India ?
Have you ever worked in/for a govt. establishment ? Forget, govt., have you ever worked in India ?
regds.
- madhav

[Pradeep bhatt]

Devesh,
Next time write 2 paises rather than 2 cents.