[debate] racism in humor (was blonde jokes)

[frank davis]

Originally posted by Richard Hawkes:
Originally posted by herb slocomb:
[qb]why would anyone want to contribute to the stigmatization of any group by perpetuating ANY stereotype in even a small way? Because its not ALL stigmatisation.
There appears to be double-standard at work in the use of stereotypes. We all know what we can say to our friends and colleagues and always push the boundaries a little further with them. I can jest with my Scots colleague at Daewoo about the English and Scots but you wouldn't find me walking into a bar in Glasgow and start cracking jokes about tartan skirts (not unless I fancied a Glaswegian kiss - another stereotype).
The double standard largely vanishes if we look at the context. Context is the key. If I hear a joke about gays for example it will become apparent to me if the joker is a closet gay-basher or is just trying to make a joke. If it is obvious they actually have a problem with gay people I'll will find the joke offensive, otherwise I will probably laugh. Admittedly this is a very subtle distinction and the confusion can cause offence much like your experience using the hillbilly accent. But if no malice is intended then its fair game otherwise we'll all go nuts! Everything is offensive to someone, somewhere. Causing occasional or unintended offence however is not the same as discrimination and bigotry, and is a fact of life although I never aim to offend anyone.[/QB]

All excellent points, especially that context is key. But saying if "no malice is intended" that everything is "fair game" goes too far. Jokes that are insulting and/or jokes directed at groups probably should be given special care with a somewhat higher standard. Of course motivation is key to the degree of moral culpability involved, but like in real life, complete negligence , even if not malevelant, carries some culpability. Especially if some one complains of being offended, then continuation of the joking incurrs an additional level of offensiveness.

[frank davis]

Originally posted by John Dunn:
Laughter sets the spirit free to move through even the most tragic of circumstances. It helps us shake our heads clear, get our feet back under us, restoring our sense of balance and purpose. Humor is integral to our peace of mind and to our ability to go beyond survival.
--Captain Gerald Coffee POW in Vietnam for seven years
...from his book:
[http://search.barnesandnoble.com/OopBooks/UsedBook.asp?userid=33W59VM1IZ&ean=2781536113621]
Beyond Survival[/URL]
He talks about Gallows Humor and how it was so necessary for the American POWs in VietNam. I guess one could say that laughter is similar to crying, in that they both relieve stress. Unfortunately, we don't always remember that when we need to...
[ July 23, 2003: Message edited by: John Dunn ]

Is "Gallows Humor" the same as jokes directed at insulting at specific groups of people??
I think you miss the point. There are many types of humor, jokes that point out how stupid one group of people are based on a specific gender and/or racial characteristic are just one category. Don't try to defend all offensive jokes by saying that since they are a type of humor that they are equal in merit to all other types of humor.

[R K Singh]

Originally posted by herb slocomb:
I think the context and motivation is more important.

can you elaborate this please ?
Either you dont know what kind of jokes are called insulting and racist or you are debating for the sake of discussion.

[R K Singh]

A joke:
=========
A blonde is pulled over by a couple of highway patrolmen, one a seasoned veteran and the other a wet-behind-the-ears rookie. After checking the blondes license and going thru the normal routine, the older officer tells the younger "When you give her back her licence, unzip you pants, and pull out your pecker." Shocked, the younger argues momentarily but is eventually persuaded. So, he goes back hands the young lady her license, unzips and reveals his manhood. The blonde says:
"Oh shit, not another breathalyzer!"
=========
Oh shit ,, blonde is offended.
next try
=====
A surd is pulled .....
......
"Oh shit, not another breathalyzer!"
=====
Oh shit, surd is offended..
hmmm....
lemme try again ..
=========
A woman is pulled .....
......
"Oh shit, not another breathalyzer!"
=========
Oh no .. Jessica has become angry ...
another try..
==========
A man is pulled .....
......
"Oh shit, not another breathalyzer!"
==========
Oh my God .. hird is looking for me with gun in his hand..
sorry .. I will try again to tell this joke without offending anyone.
==========
A Indian is pulled .....
......
"Oh shit, not another breathalyzer!"
==========
Shankar will kill me ..
another try ...
==========
A russian is pulled .....
......
"Oh shit, not another breathalyzer!"
==========
is Map sleeping ??
one more try ..
==========
A american is pulled .....
......
"Oh shit, not another breathalyzer!"
==========
no no .. I am already famous as anti-american..
hmm...
==========
A redneck is pulled .....
......
"Oh shit, not another breathalyzer!"
==========
Sri will laugh but who knows grandpa MM start looking for me .. ..

BUT I WANT TO TELL/SHARE THIS JOKE ....
please herb help me to share this joke with you ..
Aha !!
==========
An alien is pulled .....
......
"Oh shit, not another breathalyzer!"
==========
I hope aliens dont understand english ....

[frank davis]

Originally posted by Donald R. Cossitt:
Herb; I have found that if you don't learn to laugh at yourself once in awhile, many will do it for you. Chill out, friend; let your hair down a little, have some fun. In all of the years I know of since blonde jokes, you are the only one I have ever heard take this vain - do you work for that freedom-inept group called the ACLU?

Actually I'm brand new to being a PC cop and a feminist. This is a first for me as others who have seen my prior posts can attest. The reasons I find some things offensive are not because I can't laugh at myself since I'm neither blonde nor female, but because I suspect that all joking is not harmless in effect or motivation ( even if unconscious). It also depends on your personal history and experiences as well. Don't be so quick to judge me without knowing anything about me.
Have I gone too far? Maybe. Maybe I need to better balance my reactions agaisnt the motivations of the posters of those jokes. I have noticed that other PC people have unjustifiably made their personal standards, or the personal standards of the most sensitive people imaginable, the attempted standards of all public discourse. This is clearly wrong. Never the less, my point of view and my peronsal reactions of being offended are entitled to a hearing as well, and I am glad I am not censored (at least not unacceptably too often) in MD .

[frank davis]

Originally posted by Ravish Kumar:
A joke:
=========
A blonde is pulled over by a couple of highway patrolmen, one a seasoned veteran and the other a wet-behind-the-ears rookie. After checking the blondes license and going thru the normal routine, the older officer tells the younger "When you give her back her licence, unzip you pants, and pull out your pecker." Shocked, the younger argues momentarily but is eventually persuaded. So, he goes back hands the young lady her license, unzips and reveals his manhood. The blonde says:
"Oh shit, not another breathalyzer!"
=========
Oh shit ,, blonde is offended.
next try
=====
A surd is pulled .....
......
"Oh shit, not another breathalyzer!"
=====
Oh shit, surd is offended..
hmmm....
lemme try again ..
=========
A woman is pulled .....
......
"Oh shit, not another breathalyzer!"
=========
Oh no .. Jessica has become angry ...
another try..
==========
A man is pulled .....
......
"Oh shit, not another breathalyzer!"
==========
Oh my God .. hird is looking for me with gun in his hand..
sorry .. I will try again to tell this joke without offending anyone.
==========
A Indian is pulled .....
......
"Oh shit, not another breathalyzer!"
==========
Shankar will kill me ..
another try ...
==========
A russian is pulled .....
......
"Oh shit, not another breathalyzer!"
==========
is Map sleeping ??
one more try ..
==========
A american is pulled .....
......
"Oh shit, not another breathalyzer!"
==========
no no .. I am already famous as anti-american..
hmm...
==========
A redneck is pulled .....
......
"Oh shit, not another breathalyzer!"
==========
Sri will laugh but who knows grandpa MM start looking for me .. ..

BUT I WANT TO TELL/SHARE THIS JOKE ....
please herb help me to share this joke with you ..
Aha !!
==========
An alien is pulled .....
......
"Oh shit, not another breathalyzer!"
==========
I hope aliens dont understand english ....

Just susbtitute "I" or "my father" or "my co-worker" or any specific person instead of a group of people based on gender and/or race. Funny how you could not even imasgine doing that. Does this make the joke less funny? Now, why is it less funny? Examine the motivations, conscious or subconcious, of the joke....

[frank davis]

Originally posted by Ravish Kumar:

can you elaborate this please ?
Either you dont know what kind of jokes are called insulting and racist or you are debating for the sake of discussion.

Are you serious or are you just debating?
People may make jokes about themselves and have one motivation, yet one others may make the same joke the motivation may clearly be to downgrade that group.

[R K Singh]

>>Just susbtitute "I" or "my father" or "my co-worker" or any specific person instead of a group of people based on gender and/or race.
Can I put herb ?? Will it be OK for you
AW have you ever lived in Hostel ??
I can assume .. NO ..
Yes .. in jokes .. I, My Father, co-worker etc are used as character... OR I was in bad company.
But mind it, to use such personalized characters you should be very much personal with that person else dont use his/her name or his/her father as character.
just for you .. so that you can also laugh on this good joke ..
==========
I was pulled .....
......
"Oh shit, not another breathalyzer!"
==========
I am very much personal with me.

[frank davis]

Originally posted by Ravish Kumar:
>>Just susbtitute "I" or "my father" or "my co-worker" or any specific person instead of a group of people based on gender and/or race.
Can I put herb ?? Will it be OK for you
AW have you ever lived in Hostel ??
I can assume .. NO ..
Yes .. in jokes .. I, My Father, co-worker etc are used as character... OR I was in bad company.
But mind it, to use such perhis/her father as character.sonalized characters you should be very much personal with that person else dont use his/her name or
just for you .. so that you can also laugh on this good joke ..
==========
I was pulled .....
......
"Oh shit, not another breathalyzer!"
==========
I am very much personal with me.

I actually thought the joke was quite funny the first time I heard it years ago. Somehow now it doesn't seem as funny if I think that someone else could be offended by it. Maybe this is the ultimate in PC brainwashing - I think that if someone else will be offended, I am now offended. This is all so new and confusing for me...

[Paul McKenna]

I wonder what would happen if I were to post a joke about black people in this thread. I'm sure many would jump and have that post edited (even though there arent any/many blacks on this discussion board). So, even though the "victim" of the joke is absent, there are others to enforce PC. On the other hand, if I post a blonde joke, there is no "victim" (even though there may be a blonde on the discussion board). See the discrepancy?
The problem lies in the fact that our minds are trained to think that the blacks / gays / any historically oppressed group can get away with murder. But not the blonde, white group. This group has to be more responsible as compared to the others, they have to be more PC, more sensitive etc. IMHO, "Do unto others as you would wish others do unto you".

[R K Singh]

anyone .. what is this PC ??

[R K Singh]

Originally posted by herb slocomb:
I am now offended.

Where were you when there were jokes on redneck or on any other community/race ??
OR you are one of those persons who are quite cool and sit & watch TV if someone else house is burning and then blame whole world when fire reachs your own home.
No offence .. just curious ..

[frank davis]

Originally posted by Ravish Kumar:
anyone .. what is this PC ??

PC means "Politcally Correct". A common use of the term is in an academic setting where the professors or deans may censor certain statements or student activities that are not considered proper according to their ideology. Sometimes the truth of the statements is not relevant, but only that they must be censored because they contradict an opinion or poitical ideology ("politically incorrect"). Conservatives often charge that the media and universities suppress facts or freedom of expression that is not liberal or Left wing.

[frank davis]

Originally posted by Ravish Kumar:

Where were you when there were jokes on redneck or on any other community/race ??
OR you are one of those persons who are quite cool and sit & watch TV if someone else house is burning and then blame whole world when fire reachs your own home.
No offence .. just curious ..

You make a good point and the same one I brought up much earlier. However, I don't remember seeing any racist jokes earlier. I don't read every thread here in MD either. At the very least I have never posted such jokes except last night in a counter demonstration as a protest. (they were deleted)

[Cindy Glass]

I don't see blonde jokes as substantially damaging to any group. Of course they do highlight actual behavioral differences between different groups of people. However I see it as Men and Women, not a race issue. It is those behavioral differences that sometimes cause confusion and mis-communication between the groups. Then we create humor out of the problems that the mis-communication causes.
In this day and age, being a blonde is a CHOICE, usually made for cosmetic reasons, all wrapped up in being attractive to the opposite sex. Some females actually decide to play the "dumb blonde" part because it is a FACT that many men are attracted to that (God help them). Many of the women do not actually have "blonde" hair, but they play that "part". Of course most of those same women are laughing at the men that are attracted by that behavior. Very few of these women are actually as dumb as they pretend to be. As a result these women can easily laugh at "dumb blonde" jokes too - because the joke is really not on them.
That Breathilyzer joke is classic "Mens Fantasy". It is not a joke about women, it is laughing at MEN, and at what it is that they would like in a sex partner.
It is all based on some very deep instinctual behaviors ingrained in the species of every race on earth. Yes - there are black women (and indian women, etc) who play the "dumb blonde" part - even if they do not go so far as to actually dye their hair that color. And many men in real life try to force their women to BECOME that image. Thus is the basis for the struggle that women have had over the years.
Of course many men choose to categorize any female behavior that they do not understand as part of the same "dumb blonde" behaviors. But that is mostly just from a lack of understanding of females.
Face it - Males ARE different than Females.
These jokes just highlight a fact of nature.
I frankly think that for the most part - they are just funny. Why spoil a good thing?

[R K Singh]

Originally posted by Cindy Glass:
it is laughing at MEN,

I protest
Ban blonde jokes if its laughing at men.
Men what are you doing ....

[John Dunn]

CG However I see it as Men and Women, not a race issue. It is those behavioral differences that sometimes cause confusion and mis-communication between the groups. Then we create humor out of the problems that the mis-communication causes.
Thank you for articulating what EVERYONE on this thread already knows.
Wow, we could have probably done away with the accusations, etc and just talked about the underlying philosophical/intellectual themes and not been any worse off...

[John Dunn]

Originally posted by John Dunn:
Laughter sets the spirit free to move through even the most tragic of circumstances. It helps us shake our heads clear, get our feet back under us, restoring our sense of balance and purpose. Humor is integral to our peace of mind and to our ability to go beyond survival.
--Captain Gerald Coffee POW in Vietnam for seven years
...from his book:

Beyond Survival
He talks about Gallows Humor and how it was so necessary for the American POWs in VietNam. I guess one could say that laughter is similar to crying, in that they both relieve stress. Unfortunately, we don't always remember that when we need to...

HS: Is "Gallows Humor" the same as jokes directed at insulting at specific groups of people??
Uhhh.... No, it isn't.
HS: I think you miss the point.
I didn't miss anything. I was getting bored sh**less with this thread, and suddenly a thought popped into my head. I began to think about Gerald Coffe's book and wondered why we are wasting our time talking about this folly when we can be discussing something very interesting. So... I wrote my reply, hoping to change the subject. (It didn't work! )
HS: There are many types of humor, jokes that point out how stupid one group of people are based on a specific gender and/or racial characteristic are just one category. Don't try to defend all offensive jokes by saying that since they are a type of humor that they are equal in merit to all other types of humor.
Who's defending all types of offensive jokes?
Why did you need to lash out and post the link about Nig*** jokes? How do they compare to blonde jokes?
Why do you feel personally responsible to defend all sorts of people who probably don't need the defense?

[frank davis]

Originally posted by Cindy Glass:
I don't see blonde jokes as substantially damaging to any group. ?

I agree the damage is not substantial, but that it occurs to some degree

However I see it as Men and Women, not a race issue. ?

Probably correct 99.99 - 100 % of the time

And many men in real life try to force their women to BECOME that image. Thus is the basis for the struggle that women have had over the years..... But that is mostly just from a lack of understanding of females.

I think the jokes perpetuate these problems you mention above, even if only to a small degree.

[Michael Ernest]

Dissecting humor is really no different than dissecting a frog. Sure, you may learn something, but jokes and frogs tend to die, slowly and painfully, in the process.
You can count the number of people in this thread who were openly able to laugh at themselves on one finger, and that's really too bad.

[John Dunn]

The problem lies in the fact that our minds are trained to think that the blacks / gays / any historically oppressed group can get away with murder. But not the blonde, white group. This group has to be more responsible as compared to the others, they have to be more PC, more sensitive etc.
The blonde, white group get away with murder too, as Cindy Glass pointed out earlier.
When you compare the blonde-joke thing to historically oppressed groups you devalue their oppression. You basically say, "If we can't laugh at blacks, then we shouldn't ever laugh at anyone. - it's ALL the same." Well, it's really not the same. :roll:

[frank davis]

Originally posted by Sriraj Rajaram:
I wonder what would happen if I were to post a joke about black people in this thread. I'm sure many would jump and have that post edited (even though there arent any/many blacks on this discussion board). So, even though the "victim" of the joke is absent, there are others to enforce PC. On the other hand, if I post a blonde joke, there is no "victim" (even though there may be a blonde on the discussion board). See the discrepancy?

Of course you are correct. In fact I took your example one step farther last night and looked up such jokes on Google and posted links. You were right, they were "edited", in this case deleted.
Some people missed the obvious reason on why I did that, others actually seemed to enjoy the jokes.

[frank davis]

Originally posted by Michael Ernest:

You can count the number of people in this thread who were openly able to laugh at themselves on one finger, and that's really too bad.

Is Cindy the only blonde woman here?

[frank davis]

Originally posted by John Dunn:
The problem lies in the fact that our minds are trained to think that the blacks / gays / any historically oppressed group can get away with murder. But not the blonde, white group. This group has to be more responsible as compared to the others, they have to be more PC, more sensitive etc.
The blonde, white group get away with murder too, as Cindy Glass pointed out earlier.
When you compare the blonde-joke thing to historically oppressed groups you devalue their oppression. You basically say, "If we can't laugh at blacks, then we shouldn't ever laugh at anyone. - it's ALL the same." Well, it's really not the same. :roll:

I thought woman were a historically oppressed group with present issues today regarding problems with stereotyping ?

[Paul McKenna]

Originally posted by Ravish Kumar:
Where were you when there were jokes on redneck or on any other community/race ??

What are you talking about? I'm not blonde!! I have black hair and brown skin, but, yes![Political Incorrectness] I love blonde hair and blue eyes more than black hair and brown eyes. [/Political Incorrectness]
If you are asking me why I didnt react in a similar fashion when jokes were made about rednecks etc. well, you didnt understand my post properly. I did not say "Don't joke about blondes /blacks/ gays etc" I said, if you can joke about rednecks / blondes / blue eyed people then you should allow others to make jokes about blacks / homosexuals / asians etc. without raising the PC stick.

[Michael Ernest]

Originally posted by herb slocomb:

Is Cindy the only blonde woman here?

I dunno, is she?

[R K Singh]

Originally posted by Sriraj Rajaram:

I did not say "Don't joke about blondes /blacks/ gays etc" I said, if you can joke about rednecks / blondes / blue eyed people then you should allow others to make jokes about blacks / homosexuals / asians etc. without raising the PC stick.

But I hate racist jokes..
And my definition is different. If I find that chanracters can be replaced by anyone else then IMO its not a racist joke.
If you dont get what I mean, tell me, I will PM you some racist jokes.

[frank davis]

Originally posted by Michael Ernest:

I dunno, is she?

Then she would be the only one capable of laughing at herself in regards to the blonde jokes, as per your prior comment.

[Bhau Mhatre]

From Sriraj---------
I cant understand why people make fun of blondes in the first place?
---------------------------
Historical thing, probably? I think that a group of people (group A) feels good about itself when it gets a chance to laugh at other group (group B) for these reasons -
Group A feels threatened or used to feel so in the past by Group B
Group A has inferiority complex against Group B
Group A had suffered at the hands of Group B
Group A is irritated by Group B's behaviour
...
Some examples that fall into one or more of the above categories
Programmers cracking management jokes (inferiority complex?)
Microsoft programmers crack jokes on Java programmers and vice versa (threatened by each other?)
Tons of movies show that the cops are dumb and other people are smarter (people sometimes feel threatened by cops and thus feel subconciously good when they see that)
Americans used to crack jokes on Russians and vice versa (threatened by each other)
Americans making fun of Texans (irritated?)
Indians making fun of the Brits (indians suffered)
Jokes on OBL and al-queda (people suffered)
Canadians cracking jokes about ameircan military (irritated/annoyed)
americans cracking jokes about french military (irritated/annoyed)
Men cracking at women and vice-versa (tons of reasons)
Do you know since when did we start making fun of the Punjabis (i.e. Surd indians who wear turbans on their heads). After the Khalistan movement.
So back to your question, why people make fun of blondes in the first place? Is it a historical thing, probably? Is it true that back in 1930s a group of blonde people with blue eyes in Germany thought that they are the superior Aryan race? May be the rest of the world started cracking jokes on them later?
In most cases, a group of people (A) would make fun of other group (B) and there is some groupism, if not racism, involved. So Herb Slocomb is partly right. But hey, what better way to forget our differences then to laugh it out?

[R K Singh]

Sorry I disagree with some of the assumptions ...
Do you know since when did we start making fun of the surds ......

Good God .. this is 101% wrong .... these jokes are here way back from mughal time.
May be the rest of the world started cracking jokes on them later?
Here I am not sure .. but I am assuming that these jokes must be there before the era you are talking abt.

[Cindy Glass]

So back to your question, why people make fun of blondes in the first place?

Because when you stand back and watch a mating ritual in action, it is fairly amusing.
All the "helpless female", "dumb blonde" stuff while the male is strutting about flexing his muscles, bragging and proving how manly he is.
How can you HELP but laugh?

[Axel Janssen]

confirmed by what Kathy Sierra said, I have never met a blond girl/woman who don't like jokes about blondes.
Maybe there is a genetic link between "bad press is better than no press"-attitude and their less ratio-driven nature.
Best blond joke I have ever heard by a brazilian here in my home city.
He had a girl friend who was to speak frankly a little bit ugly. He told me that he had made the typical mistake of every brazilian to think that every blond girl is beautiful (attention indians! :roll: ).
3 weeks later I saw them together, so maybe this wasn't a joke, but a true love story.

[Mapraputa Is]

Herb: Some people missed the obvious reason on why I did that, others actually seemed to enjoy the jokes.
If you mean me, then I posted my "thanks Herb!" simply to show some people how their so-called "good laugh" or "sense of humor" may look like! Couldn't imagine anybody would actually find those jokes enjoyable or believe another human being would find them enjoyable!
Herb! I was actually impressed that a man can be conserned with women sentiments, you do not see it too often, as this thread wonderfully illustrate. Thanks, and I am Dunn with this thread!

[Paul McKenna]

Originally posted by Mumbai cha bhau:
So Herb Slocomb is partly right. But hey, what better way to forget our differences then to laugh it out?

Well said, but you failed to explain why the same logic does not apply when caucasians make jokes about other ethnic groups? The PC stick comes out from nowhere.. Arent these people entitled to some form of groupism as well? Why shouldnt they?

[Paul McKenna]

Originally posted by Ravish Kumar:

But I hate racist jokes..

Well, if the jokes about blacks appear racist to you the blonde jokes appear racist to me.

And my definition is different. If I find that chanracters can be replaced by anyone else then IMO its not a racist joke.If you dont get what I mean, tell me, I will PM you some racist jokes.

Everyone has their own opinions on every thing. And frankly, I dont see how there can be a joke in which the characters cannot be replaced. So every joke is legal!
[ July 24, 2003: Message edited by: Sriraj Rajaram ]

[Donald R. Cossitt]

Going to show my 'blonde side' here: But what the hell is a "PC cop"?
Picture of Eternity:
Four blondes at a four-way stop.
Picture of Chaos:
Four Rights activists at a four-way stop.

[R K Singh]

Originally posted by Sriraj Rajaram:

I dont see how there can be a joke in which the characters cannot be replaced. So every joke is legal!

What joke I can remeber now which one might think as anti-Hindu joke... and it is [actually it is on polytheism].
I invite you to change the characters.
==========================
Once a hindu, a muslim, a christian were going in a boat. Suddenly there was a storm. Everyone started praying to their God.
Muslim and christian were miraculously survived the storm but hindu died.
Que: Tell me why ?
Ans: because there were so many Gods & Goddesses that he could not pray to all in such a short time.
==========================
Please change the characters of this joke.
There are jokes on muslims/christian/black/white/... on everyone.
if the jokes about blacks appear racist to you
==========
A black is pulled .....
......
"Oh shit, not another breathalyzer!"
==========
This is not a racist joke.
If you want a racist joke on black, ask me .. but this time I would like to send PM.
So every joke is legal!
No. All jokes are not legal.
[ July 24, 2003: Message edited by: Ravish Kumar ]

[Bhau Mhatre]

From Ravish ---------
Good God .. this is 101% wrong .... these jokes are here way back from mughal time.
---------------------------
Yes some of the jokes are centuries old. Some are invented each new year based on the trends and life-styles in that year. But I always thought that we used different charecters in different regions of the country and that we started replacing the characters like 'sheikhchili' with 'surds' only after khalistan problem. Otherwise, why would a Tamilian or a Bihari make fun of a Surd pre-1947?

From Sriraj ---------
Well said, but you failed to explain why the same logic does not apply when caucasians make jokes about other ethnic groups?
---------------------------
The reason is already present in my previous post. Historically, if group A has been at the receving end, and if group B has been the evil-doers of some kind in the olden days, then in the modern world of PCs, (even where current generations of A and B have nothing to do with the past mistakes) group B is expected to behave more PC than others and at the same time group B is also expected to laugh it out when group A cracks one at them. imho.

[R K Singh]

Originally posted by Mumbai cha bhau:
that we started replacing the characters like 'sheikhchili' with 'surds' only after...

How old are you ??
Otherwise, why would a Tamilian or a Bihari make fun of a Surd pre-1947?
My dear, these jokes are for fun, not to make fun of anyone.
Have you ever been in Punjab/Delhi/Jammu ?? or lived with any surd... or do you know any surd ?
I guess, no ...
Bhao, you have some serious misconceptions... let us talk abt film .. Have you seen "Machis" by Gulzar.
anyway the smallest joke of the world is :
----------------------
Once there was a surd.
----------------------

[Bhau Mhatre]

From Ravish ---------
How old are you ??
Have you ever been in Punjab/Delhi/Jammu ?? or lived with any surd... or do you know any surd ?
I guess, no ...
---------------------------
ad hominem (circumstantial)
Bhau-- Otherwise, why would a Tamilian or a Bihari make fun of a Surd pre-1947?
Ravish-- My dear, these jokes are for fun, not to make fun of anyone.
Bhau-- Okay. Let me rephrase it-- As per you, the jokes are just for fun and not to make fun of surds in any way. Is that correct? So, why would a Tamilian or a Bihari use 'Surd' instead of some other community?
Ravish-- Bhao, you have some serious misconceptions...
Bhau-- Okay, i may be wrong. But that's my reasoning. Now what's yours? Why do we use 'surds' in jokes?
Ravish-- let us talk abt film .. Have you seen "Machis" by Gulzar.
Bhau-- argumentum ad verecundiam or Style Over Substance?