• Post Reply Bookmark Topic Watch Topic
  • New Topic
programming forums Java Mobile Certification Databases Caching Books Engineering Micro Controllers OS Languages Paradigms IDEs Build Tools Frameworks Application Servers Open Source This Site Careers Other Pie Elite all forums
this forum made possible by our volunteer staff, including ...
Marshals:
  • Campbell Ritchie
  • Ron McLeod
  • Paul Clapham
  • Devaka Cooray
  • Tim Cooke
Sheriffs:
  • Rob Spoor
  • Liutauras Vilda
  • paul wheaton
Saloon Keepers:
  • Tim Holloway
  • Tim Moores
  • Mikalai Zaikin
  • Carey Brown
  • Piet Souris
Bartenders:
  • Stephan van Hulst

Sean => Shawn

 
Ranch Hand
Posts: 60
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
We can see the name Sean is pronounced as Shawn... any reason?
What are other such names?
 
Marshal
Posts: 28305
95
Eclipse IDE Firefox Browser MySQL Database
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
It's an Irish name. Follow the link and read section 6.3 about orthography and pronunciation. Stop when you get a headache, I don't want to be accused of causing permanent brain damage.
 
Rancher
Posts: 4804
7
Mac OS X VI Editor Linux
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
Sadly my brother named his son Shawn because he though that was how it was spelled. We are Irish-American's, the family came over due to the potato famine in the mid-1800s. His son used Sean for a while, but then gave up due to the hassle of it not matching his legal documents.

There are a fairly large number of English (and Welsh, Scot and Irish) words that either have lost syllables or added them from the paper to the spoken word.

I often wonder how folks who are not native speakers of English every get close to speaking it.
 
greenhorn
Posts: 213
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
venkatpalli shankar narayan subramanyam
 
lowercase baba
Posts: 13091
67
Chrome Java Linux
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator

Pat Farrell wrote:Sadly my brother named his son Shawn because he though that was how it was spelled.

Why is that sad? I know several people named "Shawn".

Plus, there's Shawn Fanning, Shawn Johnson, Shawn Wayans, among many others.
 
author
Posts: 15385
6
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
I had a class with three guys: Sean, Shawn, and Shaun

Eric
 
Bartender
Posts: 4179
22
IntelliJ IDE Python Java
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator

fred rosenberger wrote:

Pat Farrell wrote:Sadly my brother named his son Shawn because he though that was how it was spelled.

Why is that sad? I know several people named "Shawn".

Plus, there's Shawn Fanning, Shawn Johnson, Shawn Wayans, among many others.



I also know a 'Shawn' spelled Saun. Not exactly sure how that was generated...
 
Ranch Hand
Posts: 399
2
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator

I had a class with three guys: Sean, Shawn, and Shaun



it would have surely been a big confusion unless the pronunciation is correct.
 
Ranch Hand
Posts: 317
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
better ask that person (confused name) how to Pronounce your name
 
Pat Farrell
Rancher
Posts: 4804
7
Mac OS X VI Editor Linux
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator

Muse Ran wrote:better ask that person (confused name) how to Pronounce your name


For sure. I don't get too many weird pronunciations of "Pat" but I do get a lot of my family name. Our family pronounces it fairly flat: fair-rel with just a little more emphasis on the first syllable. A lot of telemarketers give themselves away by doing it "far-RELL" or even fah-REL

Rolling the r's if you are hispanic is fine, altho not how we do it.
 
ParagS Kulkarni
Ranch Hand
Posts: 60
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
In italian "cc" becomes "ch"
e.g. gucci, cappuccino
 
Pat Farrell
Rancher
Posts: 4804
7
Mac OS X VI Editor Linux
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator

ParagS Kulkarni wrote:In italian "cc" becomes "ch" =


and their "zz" is pronouced "tz", see pizza is "pete-zha"
 
Master Rancher
Posts: 5045
80
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator

ParagS Kulkarni wrote:In italian "cc" becomes "ch"
e.g. gucci, cappuccino


Not really. It depends on the letter that comes next, not on the repetition of the 'c'.

'c' sounds like 'ch' in English, if the 'c' is followed by 'e' or 'i'. And 'cc' followed by 'e' or 'i' sounds the same, just a stronger 'ch' sound.

'c' sounds like 'k' in English, if the 'c' is followed by any other letter. And 'cc' followed by anything other than 'e'or 'i' sounds like a stronger 'k' sound.
 
Mike Simmons
Master Rancher
Posts: 5045
80
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
Examples:

ciao -> chow
arrivederci -> a-REEV-eh-DARE-chee
come -> KOH-meh
Boccaccio -> boh-KATCH-oh
 
Mike Simmons
Master Rancher
Posts: 5045
80
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator

Pat Farrell wrote:and their "zz" is pronouced "tz", see pizza is "pete-zha"


Hm, 'zh' must mean something different to you than it does to me. Usually I see it used for the voiced postalveolar fricative, like the 's' in 'vision'. That's not what you mean, is it? Is 'pete-zha' intended to be any different than 'pete-za'? I hope not.

Anyway, I would say the Italian 'z' or 'zz' are either 'ts' or 'dz', depending on the word, and on what region you're in. And again, this has nothing to do with doubling - 'z' and 'zz' can both be either 'ts' or 'dz'. The 'zz' is just a stronger sound.

grazie -> GRAHT-see-eh
zucchero -> DZOOK-eh-roh
 
Mike Simmons
Master Rancher
Posts: 5045
80
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator

ParagS Kulkarni wrote:What are other such names?


Some other Irish names with unexpected pronunciations:

Seamus -> SHAY-mus
Siobhan -> shih-VAHN
Maebh -> MAY-vee
Aoife -> EE-fah

I'm not Irish, nor have I lived there (unlike Italy), so the pronunciations I give here may well be incorrect. But at least they're probably more understandable than the original, for non-Irish persons.

As for the more general question about other (not necessarily Irish) names with seemingly counterintuitive pronunciations: there are many, many, many, around the world. But the British Isles are certainly a good place to start.
 
ParagS Kulkarni
Ranch Hand
Posts: 60
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
I observed in California or in Spanish also "J" is pronounced as "H".
e.g. San Jose => San Hose
One of my friend's name is Raju his boss was from Mexico & used to call him as Rahoo

Some times "J" is also pronounced as "Y"
Jalapeno, Marijuana
 
Ranch Hand
Posts: 1374
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator

ParagS Kulkarni wrote:
Some times "J" is also pronounced as "Y"
Jalapeno, ...



It is still H. Ref.
 
Mike Simmons
Master Rancher
Posts: 5045
80
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
J is pronounced like Y in many languages, such as in German as well as Scandinavian and Eastern European languages. But I can't think of any words where this is true Spanish. Certainly not for jalapeno or marijuana. Is there some regional dialect where the J's in these words are pronounced as Y?
 
Ranch Hand
Posts: 1162
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator

fred rosenberger wrote:

Pat Farrell wrote:Sadly my brother named his son Shawn because he though that was how it was spelled.

Why is that sad? I know several people named "Shawn".

Plus, there's Shawn Fanning, Shawn Johnson, Shawn Wayans, among many others.



Because Sean Connery is spelled as Sean.
 
Ranch Hand
Posts: 1855
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator

Eric Pascarello wrote:I had a class with three guys: Sean, Shawn, and Shaun

Eric



 
Sheriff
Posts: 67750
173
Mac Mac OS X IntelliJ IDE jQuery TypeScript Java iOS
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator
And don't forget Shorn:

 
Arvind Mahendra
Ranch Hand
Posts: 1162
  • Mark post as helpful
  • send pies
    Number of slices to send:
    Optional 'thank-you' note:
  • Quote
  • Report post to moderator

Bear Bibeault wrote:And don't forget Shorn:



I totally get this Mr. Bear. The sheep on the left is not shorn because it has hair but the one on the right is shorn. You are a strange man to be watching cartoons at this age though.
Do you want to know something funny? Of course you do, Sean and Shawn are both words not caught by the FF dictionary but shorn which is an English word in the dictionary is highlighted.
 
I'm not sure if I approve of this interruption. But this tiny ad checks out:
Gift giving made easy with the permaculture playing cards
https://coderanch.com/t/777758/Gift-giving-easy-permaculture-playing
reply
    Bookmark Topic Watch Topic
  • New Topic