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Raj Bansilal Champaneriya
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Hello Ranchers,

I have learned about obfuscation and I understand it's importance. But now I want to know that anyone in the industry use code obfuscation because I need to prepare a report on code obfuscation.So it would be helpful if you any techniques other than not giving source code and obfuscation to make code little bit secure.

Thanks in Advance
 
fred rosenberger
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a determined person will always be able to decompile your code, if you give it to them. All you can do is try and make it not worth the effort.
 
Jeff Verdegan
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Raj Bansilal Champaneriya wrote:Hello Ranchers,

I have learned about obfuscation and I understand it's importance.


Then you understand that its importance is almost zero.
 
Winston Gutkowski
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Raj Bansilal Champaneriya wrote:I have learned about obfuscation and I understand it's importance. But now I want to know that anyone in the industry use code obfuscation because I need to prepare a report on code obfuscation.So it would be helpful if you any techniques other than not giving source code and obfuscation to make code little bit secure.

I doubt you'll find any single answer, but personally, I'd say that code security (what I call the "Microsoft paradigm") is old hat. If there's one thing that 10 years as a system administrator taught me, it's that the Internet is a scary place, and the best you can hope for is to delay the inevitable.
An obfuscator (even a good one) will only slow down a determined cracker, so often the best 'protection' is simply to offer good support and after-sales service - unless, as for something like SAP, the product is such a monster that the mere act of plagiarising it would be formidable (not to mention questionable).

Winston
 
Raj Bansilal Champaneriya
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Thanks for your replays,

I need to present a seminar on a topic for 10 minutes so I have decided to opt for code obfuscation. So I need better understanding of topic that's why I am asking is it used in industry or not? So that I can decide my topic if this technique is not used then I have choose another topic so share your opinions.


Thanks in Advance
 
Winston Gutkowski
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Raj Bansilal Champaneriya wrote:I need to present a seminar on a topic for 10 minutes so I have decided to opt for code obfuscation. So I need better understanding of topic that's why I am asking is it used in industry or not? So that I can decide my topic if this technique is not used then I have choose another topic so share your opinions.

Well I've given you mine.

BTW, I notice that you are not the OP for this thread. What you've done is called "hijacking", and it's usually frowned upon; although it may not have been your intention.

My suggestion would be to start a new thread of your own and/or ask one of the friendly moderators to copy the relevant posts from here to a new one for you.

Winston
 
Jeff Verdegan
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Raj Bansilal Champaneriya wrote:Thanks for your replays,

I need to present a seminar on a topic for 10 minutes so I have decided to opt for code obfuscation. So I need better understanding of topic that's why I am asking is it used in industry or not? So that I can decide my topic if this technique is not used then I have choose another topic so share your opinions.


Thanks in Advance


"Is it used" is a pretty open-ended question. I don't think it's used a lot in professional Java apps, but that's just my experience. One thing you have to realize, though, is that most Java code is developed for the server side, and there, obfuscation is not usually an issue, since the "bad guys" can never get their hands on the .class files in the first place.

IMHO, a more useful application of obfuscation than security is to reduce the disk, memory, or network footprint of the final product. For instance, where I work, we use GWT, which turns Java into JavaScript. That JavaScript is then obfuscated. Functions and variables are renamed to "a", "b", etc., because it drastically reduces the size of the JavaScript we have to send over the wire to the browser. (Note that this is JavaScript and has nothing to do with Java.)

Are you focusing on technical aspects of obfuscation, or on the business case?
 
Raj Bansilal Champaneriya
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Thanks for you reply but I don't know how to ask moderator so could you please help?

If you suggest then can I delete my post and start new topic in another thread. Kindly lead me to proper thread.

Thanks in Advance
 
Winston Gutkowski
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Raj Bansilal Champaneriya wrote:Thanks for you reply but I don't know how to ask moderator so could you please help?

Moderators are super-beings with Saloon Titles of 'Bartender' and above. For example, Fred is one.

I'd suggest sending a private message to one of them (just click their name and then the 'Private message' icon in their profile screen). If it's possible, I'm sure they'll help you out; if not, they'll tell you.

Winston
 
Campbell Ritchie
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Winston Gutkowski wrote: . . . Moderators . . . I'm sure they'll help you out; if not, they'll tell you.

Winston
No sooner said than done
 
Campbell Ritchie
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Winston Gutkowski wrote: . . . Moderators are super-beings with . . .
Unwarranted flattery will get you anywhere
 
Winston Gutkowski
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Campbell Ritchie wrote:Unwarranted flattery will get you anywhere

Cheers tosh...or should that be 'tosh, sir'.

Winston
 
Raj Bansilal Champaneriya
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Jeff Verdegan wrote:

Are you focusing on technical aspects of obfuscation, or on the business case?



I am pursuing M.Sc. in I.T. and I need to present a seminar on any topic in time span of 10 minutes and I want to present Code Obfuscation using Proguard. So is it good or not?
If code obfuscation is not used in industry then there is no reason to present such obsolete topic.

Thanks in Advance
 
Paul Clapham
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Raj Bansilal Champaneriya wrote:
I am pursuing M.Sc. in I.T. and I need to present a seminar on any topic in time span of 10 minutes and I want to present Code Obfuscation using Proguard. So is it good or not?

That's kind of a over-simplified question for somebody at the MSc level, don't you think? Let me suggest that a better question would be one like, in what situations would you use it.
If code obfuscation is not used in industry then there is no reason to present such obsolete topic.

You mentioned Proguard -- if I'm not mistaken that's a commercial product which obfuscates Java code. It would be reasonable to assume that since the company has been in business for X years (you can and probably should find the value of X) that it has customers. Who would be in industry, and who would be using their product.
 
Raj Bansilal Champaneriya
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Paul Clapham wrote:

You mentioned Proguard -- if I'm not mistaken that's a commercial product which obfuscates Java code. It would be reasonable to assume that since the company has been in business for X years (you can and probably should find the value of X) that it has customers. Who would be in industry, and who would be using their product.



ProGuard is a free Java class file shrinker, optimizer, obfuscator, and preverifier. It detects and removes unused classes, fields, methods, and attributes. It optimizes bytecode and removes unused instructions. It renames the remaining classes, fields, and methods using short meaningless names. Finally, it preverifies the processed code for Java 6 or for Java Micro Edition.

And I have gone through different threads and in that Ranchers have said that obfuscators are now not in use so I am only confirming.
 
Tim Moores
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Raj Bansilal Champaneriya wrote:And I have gone through different threads and in that Ranchers have said that obfuscators are now not in use so I am only confirming.

You will find many threads where people are saying that the use of ProGuard for obfuscation is limited, as it offers no ultimate protection. You will also find many threads where people are saying that they are, in fact, using it. The rate of change in the ProGuard code base also points to an actively used product. You may want to ask this question on the ProGuard mailing list (or forum, or whatever they use).
 
Raj Bansilal Champaneriya
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Thanks Tim

If you have any experience with any obfuscator then please share.
 
Paul Clapham
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My experience with obfuscators is that I'm not using them. Like many other producers of Java code, I'm not distributing the code to other (un-trusted) parties. But I am using obfuscated code which came from another producer of Java code.

But I have to say that your strategy of asking people on forums these kinds of questions is not a very good one. You're just going to get anecdotal evidence, like what I posted. It's as if you planned to give a presentation on Marmite, and you started by going out into the street and asking passing strangers if they had ever heard of Marmite. I would expect that from a high-school student but I would expect something better from someone who has already achieved a bachelor's degree.
 
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