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Servlet popularity stats?

 
Scott Shipp
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Does anyone have any stats around the popularity of servlets right now? My sense is that it is waning. Is this just a peculiarity to my area (I live in Seattle) or is it founded in some way? Many of the people I know who were servlet programmers are doing other things now and I was talking to a friend of mine at Amazon and said he doesn't know anyone there doing much of that. Not sure how else they are accomplishing things now. They used to be all about the Java from my understanding.
 
Ulf Dittmer
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Maybe people are not writing servlets as such, but just about any Java web framework is based on servlets and servlet filters underneath (check the web.xml of any given Java web app). All the standard REST and SOAP frameworks are based on servlets as well. So I would say development has moved to a higher level, but servlets continue to be the foundation (and remain useful for specialized circumstances).
 
Bear Bibeault
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Yeah, that's like saying "no one's doing plumbing anymore, because, you know, I never see the pipes!"

 
Scott Shipp
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I'm including the frameworks in my question. I've worked with ATG and Spring. I asked my Amazon friend if he knew of teams there using anything like that. He didn't. Maybe he just isn't aware. The only people I know of are some friends at Expedia. They still use Spring stuff on Tomcat. Other devs I know talk about using Python and Ruby frameworks now, or .Net (ew!). I don't know where you guys all are from. Seattle seems a strange city where Java is shunned. I work near Google's office here. Someone has a "JAVA SUX" license plate displayed in their window at Google. I thought Google was all Java considering Android, GWT, Guava, etc.

Scott
 
Bear Bibeault
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Scott Shipp wrote:They used to be all about the Java from my understanding.


What you may be seeing is something I have been predicting for years: moving presentation layer technology from the server to the client. I believe that the big, heavy, server-side presentation layer frameworks such as JSF, Struts and even SpringMVC have the stink of the tar pits on them, and are headed for the same fate as the wooly mammoth. Rather, the server is becoming a data source (usually in the guise of a RESTful API), and all the heavy-lifting as far as presentation is concerned is done on the client with JavaScript MVC frameworks.

Java on the server continues to be useful (yes, including servlets) to implement the RESTful APIs as well as all the other server-side activities that need doing, but its days of building client-side presentation on the server are numbered.

But even on the server, NodeJS and JavaScript are the new kids in town and making inroads. Whether NodeJS will push Java off the server pedestal remains to be seen, but its something to keep an eye on.

Bear's bottom line: if you are a web developer and you are concentrating solely on Java, you are in for a world of hurt very soon. Web developers with no client-side expertise will soon not be web developers.
 
Ulf Dittmer
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Google's a big place that would be unwise to put all their eggs into a single basket. I think they use a lot of Python as well, and probably Go these days. "The best tool for the job" was never always just Java. But GWT is servlet-based as well.
 
Scott Shipp
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Just what I feared...any recommendations for a good book, course, etc to get into the JavaScript MVC world? And don't just say "Secrets of a JavaScript Ninja..." :-) I have it...
 
Bear Bibeault
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OK, if you made it through Ninja unscathed (thanks for buying my book!), you're likely ready to tackle one of the JavaScript frameworks. Firstly, be at least fluent with jQuery -- these days, it's almost a platform.

Next, choose a framework to explore: in my opinion, the ones to watch are Backbone with Handlebars (and perhaps Marionette), and AngularJS. I have a love/hate relationship with AngularJS (great in many ways, a royal PITA in many) and currently favor the more freeform approach of the Backbone stack. YMMV.

If you're interested in where the server may (emphasis on may) be going with NodeJS, that's entirely another ball of wax. It's still JavaScript, but a very different environment and eco-system than the client side. Personally, I've still got so much to do and learn on the client that I haven't really been making much traction into NodeJS on the server. *





* So I still write my server RESTful APIs in Java.
 
Bear Bibeault
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P.S. With regards to books, I have yet to see any book on the client side MVC stuff that I think is worth recommending.
 
Joe Areeda
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With regards to client side frameworks. I'm working my way through jQuery in Action another of Bear's books.

So far so good. I'm doing much better than I was on my own. Well worth the time and money.

Joe
 
Scott Shipp
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It should be said: Thanks Bear! Passing your knowledge on in these books is a huge service to all the developers out there.
 
Bear Bibeault
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Thanks Scott -- appreciate the feedback!
 
margaret gillon
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Bear wrote:
P.S. With regards to books, I have yet to see any book on the client side MVC stuff that I think is worth recommending.


Ah... so this subject will be your next book ?
 
Bear Bibeault
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Sadly, no. But I'm not at liberty as yet to reveal what it is.
 
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