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Rapid application development platform

 
H. Rike
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I am looking for Rapid application development platform for business applications (customers, warehouses, orders...) with integrated application and database server, SWT/Swing/JavaFX (like Eclipse WindowBuilder) and automatical data binding with data broadcasting. Some product, which was made and tested as platform and has prepared GUI for forms, databases, relations, integrated authorisation/roles... Only what developer should write as own code is business logic.
Do you have any idea?
 
Knute Snortum
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Well, you said no JavaFX, but what about Scene Builder? It's a GUI form builder for JavaFX.
 
Winston Gutkowski
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H. Rike wrote:Do you have any idea?

I wasn't going to say anything before an expert like Knute, because my knowledge of GUIs could fit on a pinhead; but it seems to me that you're shooting yourself in the foot by adding the "no JavaFX" proviso.

FX definitely seems to be the "shining path", and I wouldn't be at all surprised if Swing is declared as "legacy" code fairly soon; so my advice would be to adopt a RAD platform that meets your other requirements.

But that's just my opinion from the bleachers.

Winston
 
H. Rike
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Winston Gutkowski wrote:FX definitely seems to be the "shining path", and I wouldn't be at all surprised if Swing is declared as "legacy" code fairly soon; so my advice would be to adopt a RAD platform that meets your other requirements.

I read, that JavaFX is not good for windows desktop application, because of problems with handling events. Maybe a hoax
 
Winston Gutkowski
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H. Rike wrote:I read, that JavaFX is not good for windows desktop application, because of problems with handling events. Maybe a hoax

Simple answer: I have no idea. Way beyond my pay-grade, GUI-wise.

However, you might get a more informed answer to that question in one of our GUi forums. I'll move this thread as soon as I find an appropriate one.

Winston
 
Winston Gutkowski
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Winston Gutkowski wrote:I'll move this thread as soon as I find an appropriate one.

Moved to our FX forum. The bods there may be able to answer your question better.

HIH

Winston
 
Paul Clapham
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H. Rike wrote:I read, that JavaFX is not good for windows desktop application, because of problems with handling events. Maybe a hoax


Programming based on rumours and innuendo? There's far too much of that going on. So post your link to this rumour and let people evaluate it for you.
 
H. Rike
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Paul Clapham wrote:Programming based on rumours and innuendo? There's far too much of that going on. So post your link to this rumour and let people evaluate it for you.

I am Java rookie, so I read and read... (Article is not in English).
But let's back to my question. Any RAD platform for developing desktop applications?
 
Winston Gutkowski
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H. Rike wrote:I am Java rookie, so I read and read... (Article is not in English).
But let's back to my question. Any RAD platform for developing desktop applications?

You've already been given one, but it involves the "dreaded" JavaFX; so I'd say it's worth finding out whether that article you read and read is really true before you make stipulations like "no JavaFX".

It might, for example, be warning about extreme cases like rendering gigabytes of fast-action 150fps video at 1080p (or whatever the latest standard is), or hellish gaming scenarios, rather than normal practise.

My advice, as I said before (and with all the caveats I gave above), is that I wouldn't rely on Swing being the de-facto standard for Java GUI for very long.

Winston
 
H. Rike
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Winston Gutkowski wrote:You've already been given one, but it involves the "dreaded" JavaFX; so I'd say it's worth finding out whether that article you read and read is really true before you make stipulations like "no JavaFX".

I can't change my first post, so I can't remove "no JavaFX".
On the other hand, at first sight, isn't Scene Builder primary for building mobile applications?
I really need to build product, which will be primary controled by keyboard, so it makes me worry.
 
Winston Gutkowski
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H. Rike wrote:I can't change my first post, so I can't remove "no JavaFX".

Sure you can. Just use the 'Edit' key. Or, if you run into problems, I can do it for you.

On the other hand, at first sight, isn't Scene Builder primary for building mobile applications?
I really need to build product, which will be primary controled by keyboard, so it makes me worry.

Again, way above my pay-grade. I'll let the FX experts answer that one.

Winston
 
H. Rike
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Winston Gutkowski wrote:Sure you can. Just use the 'Edit' key. Or, if you run into problems, I can do it for you.

I think there is some time limit for editing. Please remove "not JavaFX" and change SWT/Swing/JavaFX.
 
Winston Gutkowski
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H. Rike wrote:I think there is some time limit for editing. Please remove "not JavaFX" and change SWT/Swing/JavaFX.

OK. Done.

Winston
 
Knute Snortum
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isn't Scene Builder primary for building mobile applications?

I'm using it to build a desktop app right now. Despite what Winston says, I'm no expert, but you can see what I've done so far here: https://github.com/ksnortum/home-finance
 
H. Rike
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OK, I tried SceneBuilder, but it's not platform, there is no automatical data binding with data broadcasting atc. I need it all-in-one, as you can see for example here. I am looking for something similar in Java.
 
Winston Gutkowski
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H. Rike wrote:OK, I tried SceneBuilder, but it's not platform, there is no automatical data binding with data broadcasting atc.

I think you'll have to explain those terms to us, because I, for one, don't understand what you want.

If you want a product that somehow magically paints all your screens for you, and automatically binds all your database tables to Java objects with no effort or expertise on your part, then you're looking for something that probably doesn't exist - inside Java or out.

A product like Progress might be closest to your wishes because it's a database with it's own integrated language and GUI system that includes a web interface. However, it is NOT a native SQL database. You can use SQL with it, but it's a "bolt on"; and AFAIK the native language still uses its own data retrieval syntax.

It also costs money (and it's not cheap), and it means buying into a whole different philosophy - not to mention learning an entirely new language - so you want to think very carefully before you go down that road. I used it for several years back in the 00's, and loved it; but the market share is still very small and it really is a very different way of working.

In the Java world, there are all sorts of products that help you to:
  • paint screens (SceneBuilder and others).
  • connect to and run queries on databases (JDBC).
  • bind database tables to Java objects (JPA, Hibernate).
  • write websites (JSP, Spring, and others).
  • but none of them are simply going to be "point and shoot". They take a LOT of learning.

    So I suspect you're looking for a "magic bullet" that simply doesn't exist.

    Winston
     
    H. Rike
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    Thank you for your reply. I found some other platforms: RapidClipse, Eclipse Scout, EntireJ (what about future? Web looks abandoned...), Servoy, Lansa, Magic XPA etc. Progress looks also good, I will try it.
    I know something about Java, MVC, MVVM, SQL, so learning spend a little less time, but develop product without using any of above mentioned platform is slow. And that's the problem. In that platforms are (as they said) many usecases prepared and optimized.
     
    Winston Gutkowski
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    H. Rike wrote:I know something about Java, MVC, MVVM, SQL, so learning spend a little less time, but develop product without using any of above mentioned platform is slow. And that's the problem. In that platforms are (as they said) many usecases prepared and optimized.

    But what you may find is that if you want to do anything that they don't provide for, you're back to square one (and possibly worse).

    Also: be wary of anything that includes the word "development" (as in RAD) unless it also guarantees production-strength code; because in some cases (many in my day) you could be buying a prototyping tool - which is NOT the same thing as an end-user solution.

    HIH

    Winston
     
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