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XP, design, and UML

 
jason adam
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I'm currently taking a OOAD class, and of course one of the hot topics is XP. My question is who here actually works in an XP environment, how do you use UML and design, if at all, and is the XP process actually effective/productive/cost-efficient/etc., or is this just a fad that will be replaced in time by some other radical idea?
While I like the ideas and concepts of XP, it seems it would be a hard methodology to use in anything other than a small independent software company. Though I don't currently work as a developer, I work as a Sys. Admin. for a large, international corporation, and documentation is of a high priority. Also, we seem to take a hands off approach to the development of a product, and simply want the end result. How do y'all who have been developing for years see XP actually being implemented in the real-world, versus in books and periodicals?
Thanks!
Jason
 
Marilyn de Queiroz
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Although we used pair-programming somewhat, we didn't use XP strictly at work. However, I attended a lecture given by Martin Fowler (and a pre-lecture given by Michael Two) where they described how XP worked to improve the creation of a large project they were creating. Even though the group is larger than the recommended size for XP, they were able to break the group down into smaller subgroups of about 20 programmers each and utilize the XP precepts. http://www.xpdenver.org/
 
Johannes de Jong
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Jason look at this thread.
I know that awhile ago XP was discussed pretty heavy here in this forum. I don't have time know too look for the threads. Bu I suggest you do a search yourself. It's also my experience that guys like Kyle Brown , in the thread above and Martin Fowler are very open to direct e-mail question on/about XP. Frank Carver is also a great source of knowledge on the subject, though I'm not sure if has actual experience about XP.
Good luck
 
jason adam
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Thanks guys, appreciate the links Just wished I had known about XP Denver before all of this, they had Mr. Fowler at their last meeting, that would have been a treat to see. Will have to make the next one, if I don't have class that night.
Jason
 
Alan Shalloway
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I hope this isn't considered too much of a plug, but since Jason mentioned he was in Denver, I wanted to point out that I'm doing a course in November, in Denver, on just this topic - a lightweight methodology very much like XP that takes advantage of Design patterns. See http://www.completeprogrammer.net/seminars/lpa.htm for information on it.
------------------
Alan Shalloway,
Look for Jim Trott and my book: Design Patterns Explained
Visit our site Net Objectives.
Visit our Design Patterns Explained Community of Practice
Check out our CDROM based audio training in XML
 
jason adam
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Personally, I could use all the plugs and help I can get. Currently going for my Masters in OO technologies at Regis, but I do Sys. Admin. work, not programming. I am hoping to move into development at the beginning of Spring. Don't think work would cover the expense of the class, though it sounds like something I would be interested in taking. I'll definitely pass the info along in my class though.
Keep passing on the info, it's the only way we learn!

Jason
 
Ilja Preuss
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Originally posted by jason adam:
[...]in an XP environment, how do you use UML and design, if at all[...]?

Two links may be interesting:
http://martinfowler.com/articles/designDead.html
http://www.xprogramming.com/xpmag/EXP%20Documentation%20in%20XP.htm
 
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